Frequent CTD after a few minutes, related with system spec or OS?

A

aryadwi_ef641030

Wait for 5 minutes
I don't know if this is the right place for posting this thread, but anyway I want to share a problem that suffered my TRS22 installation.

Currently I ran Steam version of TRS22 PE (build number : 122427), but however my TRS22 PE suffered CTD for multiple times with same pattern, which is "CTD occurs after running a session or editing route for some minutes" (and yeah, even running built-in or DLC routes and sessions would be interrupted with CTD). Before someone asks about my system, here is a detailed spec :

- OS : Windows 10 Pro (64-bit)
- CPU : Intel Core i7-10700 @ 2.90 GHz (8 cores)
- RAM : 16.0 GB DDR4 Single Channel (3200 MHz)
- Motherboard : Gigabyte B560M-DS3H V2
- Graphics : NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 12GB
- Storage :
- Seagate ST1000DM003-1ER162 (1 TB, actual capacity 930 GB - divided as C: and F: )
- Seagate ST3250318AS (250 GB, actual capacity 232.6 GB - divided as D: and E: )
- Seagate ST2000DM008-2FR102 (2 TB, actual capacity 1.81 TB - positioned as G: )
- Audio : Realtek High Definition Audio

According to one of replies found in this thread, there is a possibility that such CTDs could be caused by the machine that is underspec, but unfortunately I don't know whether my system is really underspec or not (of course I've already increased my system's page file as advised by JCitron in that thread, though at this time still not properly works) as theoretically it would be powerful enough to run TRS22.

If someone could help me in troubleshooting this problem, I would certainly giving deep gratitude. :)

Thanks in advance,

Arya.
 
Last edited:
ніколи не використовуйте файл підкачки на SDD, тому що таке використання SSD знищує його протягом кількох днів активного використання

Translated by moderator:
never use a paging file on an SDD, because this use of the SSD destroys it within a few days of active use
Note by moderator:
Only post in English unless you are in a language specific forum.
Only reply in English unless you are in a language specific forum.
Pretty sure this is a new account of the person who was making a mess earlier, but giving him the benefit of the doubt.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
aryadwi_ef641030 said:
I don't know if this is the right place for posting this thread, but anyway I want to share a problem that suffered my TRS22 installation.

Currently I ran Steam version of TRS22 PE (build number : 122427), but however my TRS22 PE suffered CTD for multiple times with same pattern, which is "CTD occurs after running a session or editing route for some minutes" (and yeah, even running built-in or DLC routes and sessions would be interrupted with CTD). Before someone asks about my system, here is a detailed spec :

- OS : Windows 10 Pro (64-bit)
- CPU : Intel Core i7-10700 @ 2.90 GHz (8 cores)
- RAM : 16.0 GB DDR4 Single Channel (3200 MHz)
- Motherboard : Gigabyte B560M-DS3H V2
- Graphics : NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 12GB
- Storage :
- Seagate ST1000DM003-1ER162 (1 TB, actual capacity 930 GB - divided as C: and F:)
- Seagate ST3250318AS (250 GB, actual capacity 232.6 GB - divided as D: and E:)
- Seagate ST2000DM008-2FR102 (2 TB, actual capacity 1.81 TB - positioned as G:)
- Audio : Realtek High Definition Audio

According to one of replies found in this thread, there is a possibility that such CTDs could be caused by the machine that is underspec, but unfortunately I don't know whether my system is really underspec or not (of course I've already increased my system's page file as advised by JCitron in that thread, though at this time still not properly works) as theoretically it would be powerful enough to run TRS22.

If someone could help me in troubleshooting this problem, I would certainly giving deep gratitude. :)

Thanks in advance,

Arya.
Click to expand...
Hi Arya,

Your PC is not under spec at all. I have a very similar spec to yours and suffer the same problem. Mine can crash while sitting idle in the main menu screen. Sometimes it can be a few minutes idle, sometimes it will not crash at all. This for me, has come about since the last couple of updates and unfortunately (for me) changes have been made to the route and saved which means I cannot rollback.

Is this happening on all routes or just the one? Does it happen if left idle?

John
 
це говорить про те, що платинове видання гри наповнене дірками та помилками

Translated by moderator:
this suggests that the platinum edition of the game is full of holes and bugs
Note by moderator:
Only post in English unless you are in a language specific forum.
Only reply in English unless you are in a language specific forum.
Pretty sure this is a new account of the person who was making a mess earlier, but giving him the benefit of the doubt.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
shi4 said:
never use a paging file on an SDD, because this use of the SSD destroys it within a few days of active use
Click to expand...
My system is purely still using conventional HDD, which means I could throw additional page file to any drive (currently I added another page file at my F: drive).

johnarran said:
Hi Arya,

Your PC is not under spec at all. I have a very similar spec to yours and suffer the same problem. Mine can crash while sitting idle in the main menu screen. Sometimes it can be a few minutes idle, sometimes it will not crash at all. This for me, has come about since the last couple of updates and unfortunately (for me) changes have been made to the route and saved which means I cannot rollback.

Is this happening on all routes or just the one? Does it happen if left idle?

John
Click to expand...
Good evening, John. Generally it would happen when opening all routes in my installation, but it would mainly occurs if there is an editing in progress (or even just opening a route without doing anything). But probably I had to spare my money for a second 16 GB, in case if I found that the TRS22 itself eats more memory than the expected. And seeing from your testimony, I'm curious if there is a bug that went undetected and only appears after release to the public...
 
I know that such holes and bugs are annoying (and is really painful not only for the developer, but also the user). However, the CTD one is really annoyed me, to the point that it made me began to think that "there is an undetected bug that went away with the release". I only hope that the development team could address this problem more thoroughly than before (maybe I had to throw a bug report although not now, since I'm getting busy with other things in the real life)...
 
Steam releases go through a slightly different compilation process than the N3V direct builds hence the different build number. So they don't get a final testing that release candidate builds do so there may be a bug. You also need to make sure that any software that scans for malware or viruses are not scanning the TRS22 PE folder under the Steam folder or your local data folder where ever it is pointed. This scanning process can cause a file to be locked when trainz tries to access it and the likely result is a crash. You may also want to verify the installation files are all present by right clicking on the program name and choosing Properties then choose installed files to get to that option.
 
wreeder said:
Steam releases go through a slightly different compilation process than the N3V direct builds hence the different build number. So they don't get a final testing that release candidate builds do so there may be a bug.
Click to expand...
Translated by moderator:
Thank you for such valuable information. This means that the quality control of Steam releases is much worse than other releases. This means that Steam users are not getting the latest updates. The number of Steam users usually far exceeds the number of direct buyers through the developer's site. We draw conclusions. Thank you.

Moderator note:
Only post in English unless you are in a language specific forum.
Only reply in English unless you are in a language specific forum.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
wreeder said:
Steam releases go through a slightly different compilation process than the N3V direct builds hence the different build number. So they don't get a final testing that release candidate builds do so there may be a bug. You also need to make sure that any software that scans for malware or viruses are not scanning the TRS22 PE folder under the Steam folder or your local data folder where ever it is pointed. This scanning process can cause a file to be locked when trainz tries to access it and the likely result is a crash. You may also want to verify the installation files are all present by right clicking on the program name and choosing Properties then choose installed files to get to that option.
Click to expand...
AFAIK I've already put the main program folder into the exception list, but I'll give a try for local data folder itself (yeah, antiviruses are sometimes too annoying for something that is actually not dangerous).

-Edit : just tested once again by playing one of session from tume's Milwaukee Road Avery-Drexel, and it also concludes with a CTD. Probably I had to perform another testing in different routes to ensure whether it is really a built-in bug within the software itself, or my installation is somewhat came in bad condition.
 
Last edited:
Hardware issues can range from heat, caused by clogged fans and vents, corrupted or faulty disks, or bad RAM. Something in Windows can be corrupted including a driver, or a system file and as mentioned the antivirus can be a bit over zealous and stomp on Trainz and kill the program and corrupt data.

If the hardware checks out okay, I would look at the content and if you haven't already, run a database repair. Once you've had a crash, there will now be a tendency for more frequent crashes.

In the past, I have encountered faulty scripts and even faulty assets causing crashes. A bad texture or corrupted mesh, not bad enough to be caught by Content Manager, can cause a crash and send us to the desktop. The problem is this process takes a process of elimination to find the faulty asset, but since this appears to be a global issue affecting many routes, I would clean up the cache/library folder to start with since these scripts are used throughout on all routes then go through the elimination process later.

Using File Explorer, navigate to your data folder and then open the cache/library folder and delete the contents. This process can take a few minutes and will appear to freeze but it's actually doing something in the background. This is due to the number of small files and the progress bar moving faster than the delete process.

Once this is completed, empty the recycle bin, defragment the hard drive and try again.

Start up and pray... If you have any luck, this fixed the problem, otherwise we need to look further. Try this and let us know the results.
 
I have a Dell Inspiron with TRS22 installed, it runs it - not well, but but runs it nevertheless without CTD.
In that sense it outperforms the desktop, which runs it well but with CTDs.
 
Last edited:
JCitron said:
Hardware issues can range from heat, caused by clogged fans and vents, corrupted or faulty disks, or bad RAM. Something in Windows can be corrupted including a driver, or a system file and as mentioned the antivirus can be a bit over zealous and stomp on Trainz and kill the program and corrupt data.

If the hardware checks out okay, I would look at the content and if you haven't already, run a database repair. Once you've had a crash, there will now be a tendency for more frequent crashes.

In the past, I have encountered faulty scripts and even faulty assets causing crashes. A bad texture or corrupted mesh, not bad enough to be caught by Content Manager, can cause a crash and send us to the desktop. The problem is this process takes a process of elimination to find the faulty asset, but since this appears to be a global issue affecting many routes, I would clean up the cache/library folder to start with since these scripts are used throughout on all routes then go through the elimination process later.

Using File Explorer, navigate to your data folder and then open the cache/library folder and delete the contents. This process can take a few minutes and will appear to freeze but it's actually doing something in the background. This is due to the number of small files and the progress bar moving faster than the delete process.

Once this is completed, empty the recycle bin, defragment the hard drive and try again.

Start up and pray... If you have any luck, this fixed the problem, otherwise we need to look further. Try this and let us know the results.
Click to expand...
I'll try the cache clearing ones, since the hardware seems to be OK (but nevertheless I've already decided to add another 16 GB to ensure that there is enough room for executing similar work).

And yeah, it's really a painful thing when looking about "who's the real culprit". 😑

EDIT : the problem still persists, even after trying clearing the cache and reinstalling TRS22 (as well as defragging the hard drive). Not sure if 16 GB alone is more than enough or still insufficient, but maybe I have to search for another solutions (and of course it would trigger another painful work). 😑
 
Last edited:
After adding another 16 GB to my RAM (bringing a total to 32 GB) and fiddling with the size for page file, I found out that the CTD problem when working in Surveyor mode generally stops to occur, though it would reappear when doing something in Driver mode, or when adding a train (not sure about why it still happens, and yeah it's very mysterious). On the other hand, it looks like I had to install additional fan in the casing for solving overheat problem that triggered forced shut down, since after I replaced my old Radeon RX570 with GeForce RTX3060 the amount of heat released from graphics card increases dramatically (I have to allocate another money for purchasing that one, along with replacing PSU to a more powerful one).

But anyway, I hope that the strange CTD in current release version could be solved in the future (as someone on the other thread also complained about it)... 😅
 
These things can definitely cause a crash as I mentioned. If your power supply wasn't quite up to it, the extra power draw could cause the voltage to drop just enough to flake out the RAM causing the crash.

The extra RAM is good anyway, though so that's not a waste.
 
JCitron said:
These things can definitely cause a crash as I mentioned. If your power supply wasn't quite up to it, the extra power draw could cause the voltage to drop just enough to flake out the RAM causing the crash.

The extra RAM is good anyway, though so that's not a waste.
Click to expand...
Yep, extra RAM definitely good enough for preventing conflict regarding which one that must be prioritized for accessing RAM, since it is very annoying if a RAM-eater program conflicts with another RAM-eater if the capacity is insufficient.

About the power supply, I have plan to replace my current one (550W) with either 650W or 750W, as I thought it would be powerful enough to fed my PC (of course I also have to add cooler fan in the casing to alleviate the heat).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top