Duo & Quad CPU

[trainmetal]

I saw in a thread somewhere that trainz only uses one card of an SLI set anyway, or something. (I don't know personally, but that is what I've heard)

Popular misconception I'm afraid. While it is correct that trainz is not optimised for SLI, it is possible to use SLI. Below is some information on how to do this, via a profile and a Nvidia application called coolbits.

There is a pre-defined profile for Trainz 2004 see http://www.slizone.com/object/slizone2_game.html however, you can create your own profile for games etc, just follow this guide http://www.slizone.com/page/slizone_appprofile.html

So, from what I can see, SLI is very much possible. All I need now, is to save up some money for a SLI rig

 

[meatloaf747]

I believe both companies, nVidia and ATi are working on multi-core GPU's now, the closest thing that we had was the 7950 GX2 which had 2x 7950 GT chips (GPU's) on the one graphics card. From memory this was released just before SLi, which killed the idea.
Not really, its differently...

Gidday,
Just want to correct a minor error. PCI-Express 16 SLI motherboards were out well before nVidia 7950 GX2 video card came out. (the 7950 GX2 was the first card out to have a total of 48 pixel pipeline/s).
I was upgrading at the time when the 7950 GX2 was launched and had to choose between a 2 X 7800GTX SLI setup or the 7950 GX2.
I choose the 7950 GX2 because it worked out about 40% cheaper at the time.
Great video card !!! (it's served me well). Still is......................
There is no question that if you can afford a top end SLI setup, it will give you a much better performance running Trainz. (higher frame rate). All versions.........
Trainz doesn't need to be re-written to work well with a SLI setup. (Put simply, with a SLI setup, you have more horsepower sharing the load).
I'm looking at upgrading again and have looked at both options. I've choosen a single card option, the nDivia 8800 Ultra. (This option is much cheaper than 2 x 8800GTX's in SLI).
Hope this help's alittle.
Cheers, Mac.

 

[marvschwenke]

In order for a program to benifit from SLI, there must be an SLI "Profile", and there is none for Trainz that I am aware of.

 

[meatloaf747]

Your partly right, I'm partly wrong!!!

In order for a program to benifit from SLI, there must be an SLI "Profile", and there is none for Trainz that I am aware of.

Hi marvschwenke,
Your partly right, I'm partly wrong! (I was misinformed) re; Trainz 2004, Trainz 2006 & TC all having been nDivia SLI "profiled"
After checking, it appears that only Trainz 2004 has been "profiled" (sorry about that)...
My mistake & my appoligies. (I've just learnt a valuable lession to personally "check out" the information first next time, rather than rely on the "hear say" of someone else).
Wouldn't take much for someone to ask nDivia to "Profile" Trainz 06 & TC.

http://www.slizone.com/object/slizone2_game.html

Optimized GamesBack to SLI Ecosystem
NVIDIA® SLI™ technology can be enabled for every gaming application. In addition, to provide the optimal 'out-of-box' experience, NVIDIA has created an extensive set of over 500 custom application profiles which enable SLI technology automatically and optimize scaling performance. These optimized applications, are enabled automatically with no control panel changes required.
If you want to create your own optimized application profile to enable SLI for a game not found in this list, simply follow these quick instructions.
If your favorite game isn't found in; http://www.slizone.com/object/slizone2_game.html you can also submit a request to have this profile added to the next driver release.

Trainz Railroad Simulator 2004 (already "profiled")

Cheers, Mac

 

[AussieNightcrawler]

Gidday,
Just want to correct a minor error. PCI-Express 16 SLI motherboards were out well before nVidia 7950 GX2 video card came out. (the 7950 GX2 was the first card out to have a total of 48 pixel pipeline/s).
I was upgrading at the time when the 7950 GX2 was launched and had to choose between a 2 X 7800GTX SLI setup or the 7950 GX2.
I choose the 7950 GX2 because it worked out about 40% cheaper at the time.
Great video card !!! (it's served me well). Still is......................
There is no question that if you can afford a top end SLI setup, it will give you a much better performance running Trainz. (higher frame rate). All versions.........
Trainz doesn't need to be re-written to work well with a SLI setup. (Put simply, with a SLI setup, you have more horsepower sharing the load).
I'm looking at upgrading again and have looked at both options. I've choosen a single card option, the nDivia 8800 Ultra. (This option is much cheaper than 2 x 8800GTX's in SLI).
Hope this help's alittle.
Cheers, Mac.

(This is kinda going off topic)

Hi,

Yes I know, as I said "from memory" and I know that my memory is not the best, too much up there to remember and everything gets messed up hehe. But after more looking into it I found out that SLi came out before the 7950 GX2, though it never caught on as SLi over-powered it in the end.

Anyway, most games will run with SLi enabled, even if they don't support it, even DoW (Dawn of War) will run with in SLi with better frame rates, I know Trainz does too as I have seen it running with 2x 7600GT's in SLi.

 

[lightrail]

Quad cores are not needed unless you run a server or a very hi end math program, it's all advertisement as no one can get a CPU over 5GHz.

My duo core processor runs at 1.8ghz (so 3.6 ghz combined) - even with Trainz running on 1 core, it out performances my old single core 2.8 ghz processor my a long shot. Not even close.

 

[john259]

My duo core processor runs at 1.8ghz (so 3.6 ghz combined) - even with Trainz running on 1 core, it out performances my old single core 2.8 ghz processor my a long shot. Not even close.

I'm not doubting what you're saying but can I ask if that was with the same amount of ram, and with the same video board?

John

 

[Damned2]

My duo core processor runs at 1.8ghz (so 3.6 ghz combined) - even with Trainz running on 1 core, it out performances my old single core 2.8 ghz processor my a long shot. Not even close.

Have you compared your cache & bus speeds. I got a new machine to replace one that's hooked up to my TV that died. No real difference in processor speed to what was my game machine, but the cache was 4 times larger and the bus speed double, and it blew away my game machine so they've swapped roles.

 

[Capt_Scarlet]

but the problem that you have is that if the combined speed of each core gives you 6GHz in total that means that a CPU like the Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 that runs at 2.4GHz would have a combined speed of 9.6GHz.

That is a lot of power and I think you will find that breaks the speed of what motherboards can handle at present.

There are a few misconceptions here about dual or quad core processors, there is not such thing as a combined speed of each core. These processors are only as fast as the ghz speed of one core.
That they have more than one core only means that IF a program is written to use more than one core it can spread the load between them ( and few programs are able to do this, mostly video editing type of programs ) and normally even if they can its usually not a 50:50 split. An example of this is FSX where the other cores are only used to load scenary and mostly at start up and is still limited by the speed of the one core.

All a dual or quad core will allow at the moment ( until more programs are written to take advantage of them which is no small task ) is to run more proceses or programs across the cores at the same time. So now its possible to run a virus scan and play a game at the same time without the system slowing down.

Also for a game like TRS which is a single threaded program the speed of the single core is still the most important factor in its performance in combination which the graphics card.

The situation with processors at the moment is a case of the hardware being way ahead of the software being able to use the power they bring to the desktop though that will change over time.

John

 

[big_b]

Been reading this thread a seeing I have a duel core & sli rig I have been doing a few benchmarks with FRAPS over a set route.
CPU affinity was set to either 1 or 2
SLI was either on or off with all other settings controlled by program.
Option 5 was using a Nvidia profile copied off trs2004 in control panel
Trainz options are my own settings except for option 1
These are the results I got
Dave



-DepthBits=24
-StencilBits=8
-fullscreen
-Jet=bin
-cabinfov=65
-driverfov=55
-DefaultAutoMip=none
-ColorBits=32
-frequency=60
-width=1024
-height=768
-ResourceMemory=1536
-LoadingTime=5
-KeepParticles=1
-KeepAllResources=1
-ForceRealtimeLoad=1
-AreaLimit=14000
-SectionLimit=50
-AutopilotSignalDistance=350
-Intro=disable
-showkuids
-FreeIntCam
-heartbeat=0.01
////////////////////////////
// REQUIRED OPTIONS (DO NOT CHANGE)/
-time=0.0
-zfar=15140

PC Specs
Box :Antec p180 & true control 500w p/s
Processor: AMD Athlon 6400 X2 Dual Core
Motherboard: AN9 32X series 3.00 gigahertz
Memory: 3GB 800Mzh duel channel
Graphics: Xpertvision 7800GT (2x in SLI mode)
Drivers: Nvidia 6.14.11.6921
Storage: 4x Samsung 200GB SATA-II plus 2 x 200GB external backup
Sound: SB 5.1
OS: Windows XP-Home SP2
Optical : LG multidrive DVD burner
Monitorolyview V372 17 flat panel 8ms response
Printer/fax : Brother MFC-240C
Anti-virus/spam & Firewall: Zone Alarm


1.
Out of the box settings for Trainz & single graphics & duel cpu
Min 9 Max 61 Avg 52.628

2.
Out of the box settings for Trainz & SLI & duel cpu
Min 7 Max 64 Avg 55.25

3.
Using Trainz options & SLI & duel cpu
Min 11 Max 64 Avg 56.969

4
Using Trainz options & nvidia profile in SLI duel cpu
Min 9 Max 63 Avg 48.61

5.
Using Trainz options & single graphics & 1 cpu
Min 2 Max 51 Avg 24.838

4
Using Trainz options & SLI & 1 cpu
Min 19 Max 64 Avg 58.1777

 

[johnwhelan]

Been reading this thread a seeing I have a duel core & sli rig I have been doing a few benchmarks with FRAPS over a set route.
CPU affinity was set to either 1 or 2
SLI was either on or off with all other settings controlled by program.
Option 5 was using a Nvidia profile copied off trs2004 in control panel
Trainz options are my own settings except for option 1
These are the results I got
Dave



-DepthBits=24
-StencilBits=8
-fullscreen
-Jet=bin
-cabinfov=65
-driverfov=55
-DefaultAutoMip=none
-ColorBits=32
-frequency=60
-width=1024
-height=768
-ResourceMemory=1536
-LoadingTime=5
-KeepParticles=1
-KeepAllResources=1
-ForceRealtimeLoad=1
-AreaLimit=14000
-SectionLimit=50
-AutopilotSignalDistance=350
-Intro=disable
-showkuids
-FreeIntCam
-heartbeat=0.01
////////////////////////////
// REQUIRED OPTIONS (DO NOT CHANGE)/
-time=0.0
-zfar=15140

PC Specs
Box :Antec p180 & true control 500w p/s
Processor: AMD Athlon 6400 X2 Dual Core
Motherboard: AN9 32X series 3.00 gigahertz
Memory: 3GB 800Mzh duel channel
Graphics: Xpertvision 7800GT (2x in SLI mode)
Drivers: Nvidia 6.14.11.6921
Storage: 4x Samsung 200GB SATA-II plus 2 x 200GB external backup
Sound: SB 5.1
OS: Windows XP-Home SP2
Optical : LG multidrive DVD burner
Monitorolyview V372 17 flat panel 8ms response
Printer/fax : Brother MFC-240C
Anti-virus/spam & Firewall: Zone Alarm


1.
Out of the box settings for Trainz & single graphics & duel cpu
Min 9 Max 61 Avg 52.628

2.
Out of the box settings for Trainz & SLI & duel cpu
Min 7 Max 64 Avg 55.25

3.
Using Trainz options & SLI & duel cpu
Min 11 Max 64 Avg 56.969

4
Using Trainz options & nvidia profile in SLI duel cpu
Min 9 Max 63 Avg 48.61

5.
Using Trainz options & single graphics & 1 cpu
Min 2 Max 51 Avg 24.838

4
Using Trainz options & SLI & 1 cpu
Min 19 Max 64 Avg 58.1777

Interesting,

So it looks like the graphic card has more to do with performance than anything else.

Thanks John

 

[nicky9499]

Quad cores are not needed unless you run a server or a very hi end math program, it's all advertisement as no one can get a CPU over 5GHz.

There are a couple of really cute guys over at Tom's Hardware who overclocked a single core up to 5 gigahertz, and cooled it using liquid nitrogen and compressors.

 

[gisa]

LOL but who can afford liquid nitrogen and air compressors? :hehe: I've seen a clip on the internet of people use cooking oil for a coolant (although I can't see how wise that would be in the long run).

I too am intrigued by this thread and was surprised to see that according to big_b's results, that the video card is the most important thing at this time. I suppose if trainz was rewritten to use both cores to the fullest extent, then things might be different (on top of microsoft optomizing Vista for dual cores and what not)...I suppose that all of the above wont happen for a least a few years...

Perhaps a stupid question, but for those wanting to upgrade from a single core to a duel core, could you take your old single core and add it to another core to make a duel core (with a new motherboard of course!). Could someone do the same thing with a video card? (obviously I have both a single core and a decent video card ).

:wave:

Gisa ^^

 

[johnwhelan]

Perhaps a stupid question, but for those wanting to upgrade from a single core to a duel core, could you take your old single core and add it to another core to make a duel core (with a new motherboard of course!). Could someone do the same thing with a video card? (obviously I have both a single core and a decent video card ).

:wave:

Gisa ^^

No.

Cheerio John

 

[john259]

Or for a slightly longer answer http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multi-core

BTW Core2 doesn't necessary mean dual core. The 2 is the version number, not the number of cores. Potentially very confusing.

John

 

[nicky9499]

Core 2 is one core. Core 2 Duo is two Core 2s. Perhaps Core 1 referred to P4s like mine. I have noticed a slight improvement in framerates on an overclocked processor (2.75Ghz) with a Nvidia 6600GT (lousy, I know). Does anyone want to share their experiences running Trainz on different overclocked cores?

edit---
Gisa, you should have seen the one where a few clever ones used it to fry an egg!

 

[collinsl]

The main advantage of having a dual core is that trainz may well have a whole core to itself, whereas on a single core windows and hardware drivers would be pushing in every few milliseconds, decreasing performance. I use a desktop widget to monitor the performance of my dual-core (AMD6000+), and when trainz is running, the first core is at 70-80%, and the second one is at 10-20%, so windows is probably using a different core from trainz.

 

[gisa]

LOL Nicky that would have been neat to see!

I suppose it only makes sense to get the best value out of my system and then spend more when it is necessary to upgrade as opposed to constantly upgrading to stay on top of things. Perhaps next year I might do that...I just wonder as I want my route to flow smoothly and I worry that with 20 + trains going around plus scenery, that it'll kill any chance of anyone having any fun (including myself :'( ).

:wave:

Gisa ^^

 

[nicky9499]

Same here. I'm about three quarters finished with redoing the Maglev route from TRS2006. Clare Bay's gotten so big that my machine's already doing slideshows from the city limits! :hehe:

 

[007007]

All I know is that tyler, our group leader, has a core 2 duo at like 3.6ghz per core. He gets average fps of 100 on a 22" lcd. I think he has an 8800.

He doesn't use these forums, but you can contact him at www.trainzforums.com