Campaign to retain full DLS for TRS2004/06

[mezzoprezzo]

Hello Angelah.

I have read your eloquent response and respect your position.

I want this excellent game to go forward and remain financially viable as much as anyone.

~If you want Auran to listen, be practical, offer something in return, then they might just take time out to start a conversation with the community. If you don’t, then forget it.

Angela

I thought I had offered something in return.

I have to say I struggled with whether or not to start this thread. It was a case of damned if you do, and damned if you don't. I really do hope I have not made the wrong choice.

A dialogue between Auran and their customers would be helpful.

My only requested change to the Auran policy is to have access to new items, to be achieved by allowing all those excellent creators out there to continue to upload in 04. Some may even be encouraged to re-start creating.

And we pay for it, as stated from the outset.

For those 04/06 users wanting access to old content only, they buy an FCT for AU$24.99 for a full year as per the existing tarrif. That's as currently planned.

This is the bit offering something in return.

Those, like me, willing to pay for continuing full access, including new items, for TRS2004/06, would then buy TS2010 and an FCT. Auran get AU$74.94 in the first year, plus AU$24.99 for each subsequent year until a newer version has to be bought to continue the cycle.

To me that’s win-win all round.

I can then continue to use may stable 2004 canvas for as long as it lasts. And that new Trainz software staring at me from its box on the shelf, when it’s right for me, might just get loaded.



@narrowgauge

Hello Peter,

Two points.

Your post #15, I think, provides the solution and is pretty well what I’m saying. I’m in agreement with you.


Your post #8 refers,

~ There are over 117,000 items on the DLS, nearly all accessible with an FCT.~

I cannot find 117,000 items on DLS? On search “All” for TRS2004 and all boxes under, I get just over 12,000. TS2010 shows just over 16,500. Why am I getting around 90% less than you?

Casper

.

 

[meridious]

My apologies if I offended you Angelah. That was not my intention. You asked a question and I gave an answer. I must now assume that it was a rhetorical question.

 

[IsambardKingdomBrunel]

I don't think descending into a Monty Pythonesque type of "my hardship was worse than yours" is going to very productive. If someone claims they can't afford it, take it a face value. Everyone's financial circumstances are different and should not be disputed.

My hardship was worse than yours

I am definitely worse off than you. :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

IKB.

 

[NikkiA]

I am definitely worse off than you. :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

IKB.

Wow, 10 crying smileys, I can't beat that, you win sir! :hehe:

 

[IsambardKingdomBrunel]

The post stating that TRS2004 is stable is irrelevant, TS2010 is stable as well.

I have never had it crash on me.......NOT ONCE........NEVER.

IKB.

 

[IsambardKingdomBrunel]

Wow, 10 crying smileys, I can't beat that, you win sir! :hehe:

You have to have a laugh in life, Nikki.

Too many people on this forum already, that are "right up themselves". :hehe:

IKB.

 

[builder300544]

Your post #8 refers, I cannot find 117,000 items on DLS? On search “All” for TRS2004 and all boxes under, I get just over 12,000. TS2010 shows just over 16,500. Why am I getting around 90% less than you?

Casper

.

Hi,

I would disagree with the figure quoted by narrowgage.

According to CM3 there are almost 147,000 assets in total.

Cheers, John

 

[angelah]

None taken

My apologies if I offended you Angelah. That was not my intention. You asked a question and I gave an answer. I must now assume that it was a rhetorical question.

None taken pet, I was just replying...

Angela

 

[JimDep]

TRS 2010 won't run on my computer, and I can't afford a new one. I don't need Auran "support" these days, what I want is the ability to upload 1000 + content items to DLS and a highly detailed prototype route that others may enjoy.

I would consider, depending on cost, my own website to put content on for the community to download, but then we continue the problem of assets getting spread all over the globe.

If the pre TRS 2010 content uploading deadline of Sept 2010 remains in effect, I doubt it will all get on the DLS in time, so what's the point of continuing? Other content creators have emailed me with the same stance.


Easter Greetings!

 

[johnwhelan]

TRS 2010 won't run on my computer, and I can't afford a new one. I don't need Auran "support" these days, what I want is the ability to upload 1000 + content items to DLS and a highly detailed prototype route that others may enjoy.

I would consider, depending on cost, my own website to put content on for the community to download, but then we continue the problem of assets getting spread all over the globe.

If the pre TRS 2010 content uploading deadline of Sept 2010 remains in effect, I doubt it will all get on the DLS in time, so what's the point of continuing? Other content creators have emailed me with the same stance.


Easter Greetings!

Dumb question but why won't TS2010 run if another version will? Reason I ask is TS2010 can upload 1,000+ content items without any problems at all. Especially at the moment things are uploading very quickly.

TS2010 takes less computer resources to run than earlier versions hence the question.

Cheerio John

 

[ekin1972]

I personally can't wait to see that back of 2004-2006 stuff being uploaded to the DLS. When 2010 is so brilliant and so far advanced now, I really can't see why people are still bothering 2004-2006 and I for one am getting a little fed up of not seeing enough content on the DLS for 2010.:wave:

 

[cascaderailroad]

You never know how much you lose, until it's all gone, then you will be totally lost

I personally can't wait to see that back of 2004-2006 stuff being uploaded to the DLS. When 2010 is so brilliant and so far advanced now, I really can't see why people are still bothering 2004-2006 and I for one am getting a little fed up of not seeing enough content on the DLS for 2010.:wave:

And when 04/06 goes away completely, and the DLS is eradicated of all of it's excellent content, then the 09/10 DLS will be virtually empty...You will have none millions of the great old Trainz assets. You will them know how much you lost...in an upgrade to a suposedly superior product ! Which 09/10 is not ! It is stiil lame overall...and just like Vista, a complete joke.

It will take years, and years, to re-make all the old DLS stuff for 09/10 !

 

[JimDep]

Dumb question but why won't TS2010 run if another version will? Reason I ask is TS2010 can upload 1,000+ content items without any problems at all. Especially at the moment things are uploading very quickly.

TS2010 takes less computer resources to run than earlier versions hence the question.

Cheerio John

Thanks for the response.

My computer can't handle a graphics card over 128megs ,AGP. I have a Nvidia 6800 / 128 card and anything over that ( I'm told from a computer "guru" site) , even in AGP is pointless. I tried a 7000 series AGP that had 500 megs and TRS 2006 ran slower! The max overall RAM for my PC is 2 gigs. With the drawing distance sliders at about 40%, TRS 2006 runs ok with careful scenery planning, but according to the specs of 2010, I don't think it would run at a tolerable rate.

I'd love a new computer but medicals bill take priority.

Again, my concern now is that the content I'm submitting for upload won't be completed by September, so I'm looking at completing a route to share that will have missing assets because of the time restriction.

 

[johnwhelan]

Thanks for the response.

My computer can't handle a graphics card over 128megs ,AGP. I have a Nvidia 6800 / 128 card and anything over that ( I'm told from a computer "guru" site) , even in AGP is pointless. I tried a 7000 series AGP that had 500 megs and TRS 2006 ran slower! The max overall RAM for my PC is 2 gigs. With the drawing distance sliders at about 40%, TRS 2006 runs ok with careful scenery planning, but according to the specs of 2010, I don't think it would run at a tolerable rate.

I'd love a new computer but medicals bill take priority.

Again, my concern now is that the content I'm submitting for upload won't be completed by September, so I'm looking at completing a route to share that will have missing assets because of the time restriction.

I'm currently running TS2010 on a p4 2.4 with an AGP video card. It's an ATI 3850 with 512mbs of memory? On simple stuff it works fine, I do have the distance slider set to min which is the same distance as the default TRS2004/06 had. It isn't up to doing 30 frames per second on the newer layouts that come with TS2010 though but will do it on simple layouts, a little faster than TC3 which is roughly TRS2006. It does run faster with assets optimised for native mode. Since it uses DXT compression and I seem to recall your video card supports it your video card will perform asif it had 512 mb under TRS2006.

If you are creating content TS2010 does a much better job of error checking.

Cheerio John

 

[JimDep]

That's encouraging

Thanks, John!

 

[Paulsw2]

And when 04/06 goes away completely, and the DLS is eradicated of all of it's excellent content, then the 09/10 DLS will be virtually empty [...] It will take years, and years, to re-make all the old DLS stuff for 09/10 !

More paranoia from the TRS04 bunker! The DLS will not be 'eradicated' of pre-TS10 content come September and besides a lot of the older legacy content is old fashioned and primitive in today's Trainz environment and could probably do with retiring in any case. Also it's high time the DLS was purged of content that's riven with errors that show up in later versions of the game.

Auran is not a charity, it's a business and their future profitability is tied up with sales of TS10. As long as content to TRS04 standards is being uploaded to the DLS (and many uploaders are creating to this standard as it's the lowest common denominator), then what incentive does the community have to migrate to TS10 as the new common standard for Trainz? And if existing users won't adopt TS10, why should new buyers adopt it either? Allowing a 6 year old version of the game to remain the predominent standard for uploads to the DLS is just commercial suicide in the long run for Auran, so I'm surprised they've put up with it for so long!

I'm sorry that some people have old PCs that can't handle newer versions of the game. However, this does not justify the demand that Auran therefore allow TRS04 to live on with official support (and 'support' does include allowing TRS04 uploads). If people with their stone age PCs wish to stick with TRS04 then that's their choice, but they shouldn't expect Auran to subisidise it (or indeed those of us who have paid to upgrade our machines and to acquire later versions of the game).

The game needs to move on and it can't while it's weighed down by the millstone of earlier versions with their vociferous supporters who have damned every subsequent version of Trainz up to and including TS10 and who now insist that the DLS be fixed to their requirements even if it undermines the future financial viability of Auran.

I guess I'm voting NO on this thread! :hehe:

Paul

 

[martinvk]

..You will have none millions of the great old Trainz assets. You will them know how much you lost...in an upgrade to a suposedly superior product ! Which 09/10 is not ! It is stiil lame overall...and just like Vista, a complete joke.

It will take years, and years, to re-make all the old DLS stuff for 09/10 !

Where do you see millions of assets for '04?

Handles resources better, has better FPS, has layers, runs just about all previous content, hmm, sure sounds like a superior product to me but perhaps that's only because it works so well on my computer. :wave:

Since it took years to build all those assets, expecting them all to magically transform into TS2010 assets is unrealistic. It will happen one at a time when and if the original creator is interested.

 

[BLACKWATCH]

runs just about all previous content,

Only does that if you use "Compatibility Mode", not native, so what's the point buying another version, just to run it in the old mode ?

Paulsw2

If people with their stone age PCs wish to stick with TRS04

A 2 year old machine is NOT a "stone age PC", if you want to know what a stone age PC is, try an Amstrad 1512 with a greenscreen monitor, running MS.DOS 3 in command line prompt only.
Because that's what I cut my teeth on.

 

[narrowgauge]

Casper

I cannot find 117,000 items on DLS? On search “All” for TRS2004 and all boxes under, I get just over 12,000. TS2010 shows just over 16,500. Why am I getting around 90% less than you?

I don't know why, it is just what CM3 SP2 shows me. As of this morning it is 151,845, it looks as though the DLS system is getting settled down. I would sooner believe the latest figure than yours 16,000 seems very low.

Peter

Edit The figure I quoted is wrong as it included content I have on my machine, filtered for DLS only, it is 124,218. Still a substantial figure.

 

[johnwhelan]

uns just about all previous content,

Only does that if you use "Compatibility Mode", not native, so what's the point buying another version, just to run it in the old mode ?

Paulsw2
A 2 year old machine is NOT a "stone age PC", if you want to know what a stone age PC is, try an Amstrad 1512 with a greenscreen monitor, running MS.DOS 3 in command line prompt only.
Because that's what I cut my teeth on.

Let me know if any of my content set to TRS2004 won't run in TS2010 native mode. I've spent a fair amount of time correcting content. It's still labeled TRS2004 but it does run native mode.

If you have a two year old machine it probably is dual core. If you're running TRS2004 on a dual core machine just be aware that half of that expensive cpu you brought is just doing nothing.

Cheerio John