the curse of packaged routes.

D

dangavel

Well-known member
It gets a bit much when someone has to have
hinton division ,
canadian rocky mountains ,
healesville ,
kickstarter county ,
warwick wallangara,
Niddertalbahn
and avery drexel
installed just to download a dozen or so items in order to avoid the dreaded " unknown asset " curse. i just sent Pitkin a WIP cdp of my alpine tunnel route and that's what he will need to have installed in order to run it without anything missing, I cant tell which route these dozen or so assets are in , so he will have to keep on downloading hundreds of megs of assets until he covers them all. .
its utterly crazy when even auran built in items become 'packaged " unknown, it would not be so bad if there was some indication as to what route the unknown item actually was on , but with the present situation it might well be on mars for all I know.

Apologists will no doubt come out the woodwork and tell me its all my fault, so don't bother to do so, I already KNOW that , I should go through any route I make and remove anything packaged and no doubt i will try to do so when the route goes on the DLS, but the point is, I should not really have to do that , especially for built in items such as stones and stumps ! Also auran stops me from making my own versions of these items and putting them on the DLS
, which would no doubt avoid many of these issues.

Many people will not download routes with any missing assets, quite understandably they do not want to have gigabytes of assets they will never use just in order to get a few dozen, and this I am sure is restricting the number of users per route. its the biggest bane of using this product and it seems no one is ever going to do anything to help rectify the situation .

i'm not going to discuss this further as its pointless, i just wanted to get this off my chest as I find it so annoying.
 
Agreed, it is a mess. I use filters in Surveyor while building to limit the rogue packaged assets that tend to creep in to the route. I then have to have a clean install of the version the route was built in with its shipped routes and then swap out assets which are not on the DLS. I managed on the Illawarra route to whittle it down to a couple of dozen assets, but that was still too many. It seems, however, that every new payware route uses a new raft of DLS assets which then become packaged, adding to the overall mess. It's enough to put a person off building freeware routes.
cheers
Graeme
 
Agree totally. It's been one of the most frustrating issues I've faced since moving on from my iPad to TRS22.

Pete
 
I am on board with everyone else here. I have been working on a small 2-3 baseboard route and have terrible time keeping "pristine," using only DLS or Built-in assets. I have a clean install of TRS22 in order to check if I have unobtainable assets. But I'll be darned if some things have gone from DLS or Built-in to Packaged in the couple of months I've worked on the project. I'm feel like giving up and not upload the route because of this problem. Who knows, someone will upload a route and a whole bunch more assets become packaged and require downloading another route to make mine work. Why bother?
 
The extra frustration of not being able to fix any errors because the items are packaged payware. Not allowed.
 
I agree completely. And I don't understand the motivation for N3V having packaging in the first place. They are driving away route and session creators. And to make it worse, it creeps onward from build to build. I tried to run a TANE route in TRS22 and a large number of assets "disappeared" down this rat hole. Even the Auran track is unavailable on the DLS.
 
For the record, PACKAGED, means an asset that is actually ON the DLS, just included in a payware package. It is still freely available on the DLS and you can still clone it and modify that to your hearts content. Your issue isn't with packaged assets.

There is some items that this system hasn't quite worked perfectly on and become a bug, but please, if you see one, contact the Helpdesk.

bolivar said:
The extra frustration of not being able to fix any errors because the items are packaged payware. Not allowed.
Click to expand...

If something is packaged payware and is faulty, it's generally because you've tried to edit them in the first place. Revert them to original, and if that doesn't work (which it does 99% of the time for me) send a ticket to the helpdesk.
 
Last edited:
H222 said:
For the record, PACKAGED, means an asset that is actually ON the DLS, just included in a payware package. It is still freely available on the DLS and you can still clone it and modify that to your hearts content. Your issue isn't with packaged assets.
Click to expand...

I think you are mistaken, here are 118 assets on my route that are PACKAGED and not on the DLS.

<kuid2:122860:100254:3> dirt002 seasonal
<kuid:453099:100950> FFR Rock Cliff 01 (Brown)
<kuid2:124017:20118:3> Corrugated Fence
<kuid2:82412:611118:2> TUME-Bridge-Support-TS12-102
<kuid2:124017:10030:3> Scrapyard Crane
<kuid:565830:100206> (TS12) GrassDarkRocky Ground
<kuid2:93112:37092:2> Chainlink-Security-Fence
<kuid2:523:19723060:1> Tree RiverBirch 01
<kuid:179468:210100> Asphalt
<kuid:453099:100941> FFR Grass 03
<kuid2:149987:21709:3> asphalt 03 - Seasonal
<kuid2:57230:21664:1> Donner P12 GreenRock14
<kuid2:93112:37920:1> Cuk-White-Picket-Fence
<kuid2:57230:21536:1> Donner P12 bosco
<kuid2:122860:100927:3> Roys_oak_dub_07_2_m5_4D_season
<kuid2:59692:10111:2> DEC Busch path wall
<kuid:267178:1458> Z Rock 14
<kuid2:122860:101810:1> Pool. Small commercial. Complete. F seasonal
<kuid2:122860:100018:2> dirt005 seasonal
<kuid2:138607:25004:3> Edificio 04 M
<kuid:146087:75015> strada campagna
<kuid:661281:75015> Tree Broadleaf 06 Darker
<kuid2:138607:25031:3> Edificio 31 M
<kuid2:138607:25033:3> Edificio 33 M
<kuid2:1942:37008:2> Fence_Chain_Link_2_1942
<kuid2:53261:37008:2> Guardrail
<kuid2:149987:137104:1> FMA2 igrass 04 (d) 38x10
<kuid2:82763:1104:2> Fence 3 bar pebbles and rusty rails
<kuid2:1942:37009:2> Fence_Chain_Link_1942
<kuid:453099:100938> FFR Grass 04
<kuid2:1942:37002:3> Fence_Corrugated_1942
<kuid2:82412:613301:1> Hedge-301-15-TS12
<kuid2:9000:38001:2> Invisible track
<kuid2:82412:5001055:2> Log-Stack-Scenery-23-102-TS12
<kuid2:82412:614175:1> TS12-614175-Riverstones-2
<kuid2:328583:20255:2> JVC#(Gr1) Trackside spline B
<kuid2:328583:3160:3> JVC(M)Fireweed spline#1 10x60m
<kuid2:53695:39000:1> Parkinglot
<kuid2:328583:2087:1> JVC@-Grass221s dry grass
<kuid2:82412:6001301:4> TUME-House-LO-1L-101
<kuid2:124017:20117:3> Loading Platform
<kuid:370528:1291> n railman 6
<kuid2:370528:1144:2> n_man_8a
<kuid:309161:100348> NZR Bridge walkway
<kuid2:661281:85186:1> PBR Grass Flowers 1
<kuid2:523:19723091:1> Plant ChollaCactus 01
<kuid2:523:1142:2> Plant Shrub 01
<kuid2:82412:24005:2> TUME-24005-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:124017:25029:2> Plate Girder Bridge, bendy
<kuid2:82412:6001309:5> TUME-House-LO-1L-109
<kuid2:53261:37021:3> Recinto 6
<kuid2:57230:21025:1> roccia4 con vegetazione
<kuid2:82412:614127:1> TS12-614127-Ger-Grass-02
<kuid2:82412:805103:1> Runway-103
<kuid:334896:26012> Speed Limit Sign 15
<kuid:334896:26018> Speed Limit Sign 45
<kuid:334896:26021> Speed Limit Sign 60
<kuid2:82412:44040:2> TUME-Y-Bridge-Support-101-TS12
<kuid2:60850:22024:2> Station Platforms 01 070m VSR
<kuid2:52519:27008:1> Storm Pipes 3
<kuid2:82412:614185:1> TS12-614185-Rocky-Hillside-05
<kuid2:523:19723049:1> Tree Sycamore 01
<kuid2:68213:37033:4> Streetlight 01 spline
<kuid2:1942:25025:1> Suburban House 6
<kuid2:240029:100077:2> Town House 5 2 Spline
<kuid2:1942:25005:1> Suburban House 7
<kuid2:82412:611120:3> Track-Crossing-611120-TS12
<kuid:661281:75014> Tree Broadleaf 03 Darker
<kuid2:523:19723069:1> Tree FraserFir 01
<kuid2:523:1113:3> Tree SugarMaple 03
<kuid2:523:19723075:1> Tree WhiteFir 01
<kuid2:60238:26:1> Truck
<kuid2:82412:614203:1> TS12-614203-Parking-Place-256x256
<kuid2:82412:614176:1> TS12-614176-Grey-Ballast
<kuid2:82412:614173:1> TS12-614173-Dirt-2
<kuid2:82412:614172:1> TS12-614172-Ger-Gravel
<kuid2:82412:614164:1> TS12-614164-Ger-Dirt-01
<kuid2:82412:614126:1> TS12-614126-Grass-a2
<kuid2:82412:614110:1> TS12-614110-Davenportchaparral-2-02
<kuid2:82412:614109:1> TS12-614109-Davenportchaparral-2-22
<kuid2:82412:614107:1> TS12-614107-Ger-Forest
<kuid2:82412:614105:1> TS12-614105-Ger-Forest-2
<kuid2:82412:612623:1> TS12-Grass-623
<kuid2:82412:612622:1> TS12-Grass-622-CM
<kuid2:82412:612621:1> TS12-Grass-621
<kuid2:82412:612620:1> TS12-Grass-620-CM
<kuid2:82412:6001303:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-103
<kuid2:82412:612503:1> TS12-Grass-503-Mud
<kuid2:82412:612228:1> TS12-Gravel-228-Water
<kuid2:82412:612217:1> TS12-Gravel-217-Stone-5
<kuid2:82412:613351:1> TUME-613351-Corn-50x50
<kuid2:82412:601106:1> TUME-601106-Wood-Bridge-5m-TS12
<kuid2:82412:300625:1> TUME-300625-Canvas-Covered-Load
<kuid2:82412:24034:2> TUME-24034-VW-T1
<kuid2:82412:24016:2> TUME-24016-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24015:2> TUME-24015-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24014:2> TUME-24014-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24013:2> TUME-24013-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24006:2> TUME-24006-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24002:2> TUME-24002-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:23009:1> TUME-23009-Crates
<kuid2:82412:23008:1> TUME-23008-Crates
<kuid2:82412:23007:1> TUME-23007-Crates
<kuid2:82412:23005:1> TUME-23005-Crates
<kuid2:82412:5000665:1> TUME-665-Commercial-28x16x8. It bases on a building at Othello, Wa and has been created for my Milwaukee Road Project.
<kuid2:82412:6001319:5> TUME-House-LO-1L-119
<kuid2:82412:6001318:5> TUME-House-LO-1L-118
<kuid2:82412:6001310:5> TUME-House-LO-1L-110
<kuid2:82412:6001308:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-108
<kuid2:82412:6001307:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-107
<kuid2:82412:6001306:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-106
<kuid2:82412:6001305:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-105
<kuid2:82412:210979041:1> TUME-Water-79041-03-Spline
<kuid:103475:28047> VR Stockyard Cattle Gate
<kuid2:82412:210979028:1> Water-79028-Stone-Ground-50-50-Spline
<kuid2:60238:38212:1> Wire Gates
<kuid2:506208:100085:3> YARNish L2 DL2 -Si +Sh, 09sp4
<kuid2:206307:100027:2> YZ 1 Chainlink Fence

Now I have to replace them, so no one has missing assets when the download my route.
 
Contact the helpdesk with the list and let them know. Zec mentioned this before and said they're working on getting the assets on the DLS.
 
Lewiscc65 said:
I think you are mistaken, here are 118 assets on my route that are PACKAGED and not on the DLS.

<kuid2:122860:100254:3> dirt002 seasonal
<kuid:453099:100950> FFR Rock Cliff 01 (Brown)
<kuid2:124017:20118:3> Corrugated Fence
<kuid2:82412:611118:2> TUME-Bridge-Support-TS12-102
<kuid2:124017:10030:3> Scrapyard Crane
<kuid:565830:100206> (TS12) GrassDarkRocky Ground
<kuid2:93112:37092:2> Chainlink-Security-Fence
<kuid2:523:19723060:1> Tree RiverBirch 01
<kuid:179468:210100> Asphalt
<kuid:453099:100941> FFR Grass 03
<kuid2:149987:21709:3> asphalt 03 - Seasonal
<kuid2:57230:21664:1> Donner P12 GreenRock14
<kuid2:93112:37920:1> Cuk-White-Picket-Fence
<kuid2:57230:21536:1> Donner P12 bosco
<kuid2:122860:100927:3> Roys_oak_dub_07_2_m5_4D_season
<kuid2:59692:10111:2> DEC Busch path wall
<kuid:267178:1458> Z Rock 14
<kuid2:122860:101810:1> Pool. Small commercial. Complete. F seasonal
<kuid2:122860:100018:2> dirt005 seasonal
<kuid2:138607:25004:3> Edificio 04 M
<kuid:146087:75015> strada campagna
<kuid:661281:75015> Tree Broadleaf 06 Darker
<kuid2:138607:25031:3> Edificio 31 M
<kuid2:138607:25033:3> Edificio 33 M
<kuid2:1942:37008:2> Fence_Chain_Link_2_1942
<kuid2:53261:37008:2> Guardrail
<kuid2:149987:137104:1> FMA2 igrass 04 (d) 38x10
<kuid2:82763:1104:2> Fence 3 bar pebbles and rusty rails
<kuid2:1942:37009:2> Fence_Chain_Link_1942
<kuid:453099:100938> FFR Grass 04
<kuid2:1942:37002:3> Fence_Corrugated_1942
<kuid2:82412:613301:1> Hedge-301-15-TS12
<kuid2:9000:38001:2> Invisible track
<kuid2:82412:5001055:2> Log-Stack-Scenery-23-102-TS12
<kuid2:82412:614175:1> TS12-614175-Riverstones-2
<kuid2:328583:20255:2> JVC#(Gr1) Trackside spline B
<kuid2:328583:3160:3> JVC(M)Fireweed spline#1 10x60m
<kuid2:53695:39000:1> Parkinglot
<kuid2:328583:2087:1> JVC@-Grass221s dry grass
<kuid2:82412:6001301:4> TUME-House-LO-1L-101
<kuid2:124017:20117:3> Loading Platform
<kuid:370528:1291> n railman 6
<kuid2:370528:1144:2> n_man_8a
<kuid:309161:100348> NZR Bridge walkway
<kuid2:661281:85186:1> PBR Grass Flowers 1
<kuid2:523:19723091:1> Plant ChollaCactus 01
<kuid2:523:1142:2> Plant Shrub 01
<kuid2:82412:24005:2> TUME-24005-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:124017:25029:2> Plate Girder Bridge, bendy
<kuid2:82412:6001309:5> TUME-House-LO-1L-109
<kuid2:53261:37021:3> Recinto 6
<kuid2:57230:21025:1> roccia4 con vegetazione
<kuid2:82412:614127:1> TS12-614127-Ger-Grass-02
<kuid2:82412:805103:1> Runway-103
<kuid:334896:26012> Speed Limit Sign 15
<kuid:334896:26018> Speed Limit Sign 45
<kuid:334896:26021> Speed Limit Sign 60
<kuid2:82412:44040:2> TUME-Y-Bridge-Support-101-TS12
<kuid2:60850:22024:2> Station Platforms 01 070m VSR
<kuid2:52519:27008:1> Storm Pipes 3
<kuid2:82412:614185:1> TS12-614185-Rocky-Hillside-05
<kuid2:523:19723049:1> Tree Sycamore 01
<kuid2:68213:37033:4> Streetlight 01 spline
<kuid2:1942:25025:1> Suburban House 6
<kuid2:240029:100077:2> Town House 5 2 Spline
<kuid2:1942:25005:1> Suburban House 7
<kuid2:82412:611120:3> Track-Crossing-611120-TS12
<kuid:661281:75014> Tree Broadleaf 03 Darker
<kuid2:523:19723069:1> Tree FraserFir 01
<kuid2:523:1113:3> Tree SugarMaple 03
<kuid2:523:19723075:1> Tree WhiteFir 01
<kuid2:60238:26:1> Truck
<kuid2:82412:614203:1> TS12-614203-Parking-Place-256x256
<kuid2:82412:614176:1> TS12-614176-Grey-Ballast
<kuid2:82412:614173:1> TS12-614173-Dirt-2
<kuid2:82412:614172:1> TS12-614172-Ger-Gravel
<kuid2:82412:614164:1> TS12-614164-Ger-Dirt-01
<kuid2:82412:614126:1> TS12-614126-Grass-a2
<kuid2:82412:614110:1> TS12-614110-Davenportchaparral-2-02
<kuid2:82412:614109:1> TS12-614109-Davenportchaparral-2-22
<kuid2:82412:614107:1> TS12-614107-Ger-Forest
<kuid2:82412:614105:1> TS12-614105-Ger-Forest-2
<kuid2:82412:612623:1> TS12-Grass-623
<kuid2:82412:612622:1> TS12-Grass-622-CM
<kuid2:82412:612621:1> TS12-Grass-621
<kuid2:82412:612620:1> TS12-Grass-620-CM
<kuid2:82412:6001303:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-103
<kuid2:82412:612503:1> TS12-Grass-503-Mud
<kuid2:82412:612228:1> TS12-Gravel-228-Water
<kuid2:82412:612217:1> TS12-Gravel-217-Stone-5
<kuid2:82412:613351:1> TUME-613351-Corn-50x50
<kuid2:82412:601106:1> TUME-601106-Wood-Bridge-5m-TS12
<kuid2:82412:300625:1> TUME-300625-Canvas-Covered-Load
<kuid2:82412:24034:2> TUME-24034-VW-T1
<kuid2:82412:24016:2> TUME-24016-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24015:2> TUME-24015-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24014:2> TUME-24014-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24013:2> TUME-24013-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24006:2> TUME-24006-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:24002:2> TUME-24002-Car-Pickup
<kuid2:82412:23009:1> TUME-23009-Crates
<kuid2:82412:23008:1> TUME-23008-Crates
<kuid2:82412:23007:1> TUME-23007-Crates
<kuid2:82412:23005:1> TUME-23005-Crates
<kuid2:82412:5000665:1> TUME-665-Commercial-28x16x8. It bases on a building at Othello, Wa and has been created for my Milwaukee Road Project.
<kuid2:82412:6001319:5> TUME-House-LO-1L-119
<kuid2:82412:6001318:5> TUME-House-LO-1L-118
<kuid2:82412:6001310:5> TUME-House-LO-1L-110
<kuid2:82412:6001308:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-108
<kuid2:82412:6001307:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-107
<kuid2:82412:6001306:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-106
<kuid2:82412:6001305:3> TUME-House-LO-1L-105
<kuid2:82412:210979041:1> TUME-Water-79041-03-Spline
<kuid:103475:28047> VR Stockyard Cattle Gate
<kuid2:82412:210979028:1> Water-79028-Stone-Ground-50-50-Spline
<kuid2:60238:38212:1> Wire Gates
<kuid2:506208:100085:3> YARNish L2 DL2 -Si +Sh, 09sp4
<kuid2:206307:100027:2> YZ 1 Chainlink Fence

Now I have to replace them, so no one has missing assets when the download my route.
Click to expand...

Well said sir. It's a huge and frustrating problem and certainly one of the reasons why I'm not interested in uploading layouts to the DLS anymore.
 
I have the "complete DLS" downloaded according to the Content Manager.
I have also received a large number of so called "DLC" from the "Content Store".

62000+ assets/instances are said to be "Packaged"; and thus in a "database repair" are reloaded to/from my PC, presumably negating any previous local repairs not uploaded to DLS.
Some are repairable. Some not authorised for repair. A deluge of Faulty and Missing dependancies have resulted.

Why are faulty assets (including Auran alias sources and PM Meshes) being "Packaged" ?
 
Last edited:
agree Dan


A few tips for route/session builders:
-you can have more than 1 version of the game installed
keep 1 version clean (without any DLC) to make your routes
-make good picklists for your route, with only working items that people can actually get
-The older version of Trainz you use to build, the more users can use your route
-add a kuidlist to your route/session, with working links where to get items.
 
H222 said:
For the record, PACKAGED, means an asset that is actually ON the DLS, just included in a payware package. It is still freely available on the DLS and you can still clone it and modify that to your hearts content. Your issue isn't with packaged assets.

There is some items that this system hasn't quite worked perfectly on and become a bug, but please, if you see one, contact the Helpdesk.



If something is packaged payware and is faulty, it's generally because you've tried to edit them in the first place. Revert them to original, and if that doesn't work (which it does 99% of the time for me) send a ticket to the helpdesk.
Click to expand...
I beg to differ, for pitkin, even built in items such as the rock and stump items were showing as "unknown" . the reason, on my install they are appearing as packaged, as I installed the routes I mentioned in my OP , in order for them to be used, he has to download other routes. The items may very well be available, but you have to download whatever payware or bundled routes I have installed on my computer in order for the assets to be available otherwise, they are categorised as " unknown" without an6 indication as to why they are unknown , I could see they were packaged, Pitkin could not.
the point is one should not have to have these other routes installed in order to access these items , it is the biggest downside of creating freeware routes to put up on the DLS . At the very least there should be an indication that the kuid can be found by downloading a route. No wonder some people use unauthorised third party sites to access these items, truly, one cannot blame them, since nv3 does not provide them with any way to find them within the app itself .
 
@H222 Your quote:

"If something is packaged payware and is faulty, it's generally because you've tried to edit them in the first place. Revert them to original, and if that doesn't work (which it does 99% of the time for me) send a ticket to the helpdesk."

These assets I am referring to do indeed belong to payware from TANE. But I want that asset , not the whole payware layout and attached kuids in TRS2022. So I transfer the particular kuid from TANE to TRS2022, without the whole Payware item, which i have left behind. It shows faulty in TRS22. What to do ? Unable to fix the usual suspect of faulty textures. I have to import the whole payware layout from TANE to access a faulty item that is magically not faulty as a payware item. So I have to fill my storage with payware not wanted for just a couple of kuids?
To boot, most of the config files state categorically that the kuid is not to be used in payware. How does N3V get away with that? Legally?
 
<kuid2:68213:37033:4> Streetlight 01 spline

This caught my attention since it has my kuid on it. There are some lessons in this one.

The version number :4 indicates to me that N3V took my version :3 (which was the latest one I actually made, and it's on the DLS). They probably added some stupid language and privileges tags, called it version :4, then stuck it inside a payware package without asking or even informing me. I certainly don't get any money from it (nor do I want any) but that's not the point.

I resent them doing it and have made my feelings known, but there is nothing I can do to make them stop.

However, this example does suggest that, at least for some of the assets, a version search will reveal a previous version on the DLS which is technically equivalent, perfectly valid, accessible and usable. In fact, even more so since it has not been hobbled by privilege tags, encrypted textures etc. The only downside is that it may be listed as "out of date" (or "obsolete"?).


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Yes, and thank you for your creations, Dinorius. If a person like me who has that asset (listed in 7 packages I have by the way), all the earlier versions say "Available for download, Obsolete". But if a person does NOT have it, will the "obsolete" versions even show up in DLS? I am downloading all the time, but I never see "Available for download, Obsolete" on the CM when I am looking for an asset, so I wonder if the earlier versions show up at all for anyone. And for anyone who has version :3, it is probably going to say "Installed from DLS, Newer version available", only for them to find the newer version is actually NOT available. In fact, since they initiated the new status labelling, I have had six assets that are "Packaged, Newer version available", but in fact, they aren't available to me even though I own the packages! If I list asset versions and try to download the new versions, they won't download. N3V has said they are going to "Hide" these from us, but they haven't even done that yet. It just seems like a big CF to me. And N3V has proven over and over again, they feel free to break their own rules about uploading unauthorized copies of a creator's work for profit!
 
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