What happened to the "advanced" plus version of TRS19?

Was the "plus" version of TRS19, with it's additional functionality (among them TurfFX presets IIRC) simply TRS22 with a different "working title" or is it no longer available?

I recall thinking at the time "Maybe the "retail version" of TRS19 will get those features some day(tm)" but now I see that memberships get you TRS22 - which for the moment I'm not interested in.

Or is the 'better' version of TRS19 a part of the "Access all Retail Editions (from T:ANE onwards)" part of the deal?

This ultimately rose to the top because I realized I have several TFX presets listed as "Built in" in my TRS19 content manager, but there's no way to use them...

As Trainz Plus works on the latest version and is used to test and showcase upcoming features, it is only available as a TRS22 version.
You can still purchase a standalone version of TRS22 but has none of the current Plus features, but most if not all of the features of the last TRS19 version of Plus.

So TRS19 Plus (features at least) became TRS22 Basic Retail?

This game needs a family tree.

No, the plus version is the plus version of the game. While 19 was the current version, the plus version was 19 plus additional features till towards the end of 19, then it became the testing version of 22. Now the plus version is 22 plus additional features now that 22 is available to all.

To perhaps clarify this often confusing topic.

Trainz Plus (subscription only) will always have the features of the latest retail version of Trainz plus extras.

When TRS19 Platinum Edition was the latest retail version of Trainz, Trainz Plus was TRS19 PE plus additional features. New features were added regularly (quarterly I believe).

Now that TRS22 is the latest retail version of Trainz, Trainz Plus is TRS22 plus additional features. New features are added with each update (again quarterly?). S20 is a new Trainz Plus only feature not found in TRS22. HD Terrain will be added in the next update.

When TRS25 (or whatever it will be called) becomes the next retail release of Trainz, Trainz Plus will be TRS25 plus additional features with new features added with each regular update.

So the answer to my ultimate question "is it possible to get 'TRS19 Plus additional features?' (as you referred to it) which was once the top tier prior to 22 being released." is, no.

When I thought whatever plus users got would eventually come to us all, within a given version that is, I was fine with it. But this kinda sucks.

frogpipe said:

When I thought whatever plus users got would eventually come to us all, within a given version that is, I was fine with it.

Click to expand...

TRS22 (retail) has

UDS feature that was previously only found in TRS19 Platinum Edition and Trainz Plus.
It also has Multiplayer Surveyor - found only in Trainz Plus.
New effect layer tools and presets - from Trainz Plus.
Paint under spline tool - from Trainz Plus.
New camera options - from Trainz Plus.

frogpipe said:

So the answer to my ultimate question "is it possible to get 'TRS19 Plus additional features?' (as you referred to it) which was once the top tier prior to 22 being released." is, no.

When I thought whatever plus users got would eventually come to us all, within a given version that is, I was fine with it. But this kinda sucks.

Click to expand...

The promise was that Trainz Plus features would be added to a future Trainz product. There was never a retroactive commitment that I ever heard. Trainz Plus is the only product currently under development. It contains features that are only available to subscribers. From time to time to produce a surge of revenue, N3V will compile a retail version for sale but not all subscriber only features will be included in that retail release. This is why Surveyor 2.0 is not in TRS22. I suspect that these retail releases will be more often than in the past. Perhap a TRS2023 is on the horizon.

Some of the Plus features are still in beta testing, and are still being worked on. Not a good idea to move some of those features to Retail versions until after they are finalized.

wreeder said:

The promise was that Trainz Plus features would be added to a future Trainz product. There was never a retroactive commitment that I ever heard.

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No, there wasn't. This is a case of:

Me: Gene, can you make me the richest man in the world?

Gene: Yes.

Expectation: I will get money and riches.

Reality: Everyone else is made poorer than me.

Maybe not the best example, but you get the idea. I read something, form an expectation, and then find out that I was wrong - meanwhile the reality IS completely inline with what I read.

This has been my life experience for 50+ years, I doubt it's going to change.

frogpipe said:

I read something, form an expectation, and then find out that I was wrong - meanwhile the reality IS completely inline with what I read.

Click to expand...

Welcome to the human experience. We have a tendency to read into things what we want or hope to see.

capdiamont said:

Some of the Plus features are still in beta testing, and are still being worked on. Not a good idea to move some of those features to Retail versions until after they are finalized.

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As a matter of interest, which Plus features are now considered finished (out of beta), but do not appear in TRS22 please?

I can't see any. Even MPS which is included is not yet finished. Trainz Plus is truthfully a mix of alpha features that are still in rough and unfinished condition and beta features that are buggy. Now that being said, I do think that there are many exciting features in Trainz Plus and if you want to 1. Support N3V's continued existence as a company in what is rapidly becoming a horrible world wide financial situation and 2. Have a bit of fun playing around with those often frustrating new features, I whole heartily encourage people to subscribe. At the moment, I have stopped my subscription due to the need to spend that money on other expenses but I will likely return in the future.

wreeder said:

I can't see any. Even MPS which is included is not yet finished. Trainz Plus is truthfully a mix of alpha features that are still in rough and unfinished condition and beta features that are buggy. Now that being said, I do think that there are many exciting features in Trainz Plus and if you want to 1. Support N3V's continued existence as a company in what is rapidly becoming a horrible world wide financial situation and 2. Have a bit of fun playing around with those often frustrating new features, I whole heartily encourage people to subscribe. At the moment, I have stopped my subscription due to the need to spend that money on other expenses but I will likely return in the future.

Click to expand...

I appreciate your candour.

It appears to the untutored eye that Trainz Plus is pretty much the same as the old beta program (plus a load of DLC that may or may not be wanted) with the stipulation of subscription as the qualification for entry

After various unsatisfactory Kickstarters, I’m afraid I do not accept the principle of the customer accepting the financial risks for development. I am delighted that others do.

Wreeder - please ensure you submit any bug reports. I'd love to know which features you consider Alpha and beta and buggy.

In theory, the "Beta" releases are just that, while the "official" Trainz Plus release is meant to deliver stable, functional, new features.

Albeit those features are generally Phase 1 of a multi-part release schedule in order to get the core feature into the hands of the users for feedback relating to what needs to happen next).

We're preparing our next major release and that will be by way of an "Alpha" given the magnitude of the changes and the high likelihood that all work done in the Alpha build will be throw-away and will not work in future releases.

If you're a Trainz Plus member and would like to be part of that Alpha test, please register your interest here.

Trainz Plus, Trainz Not Plus! Trainz Minus? Beta this that and the other? So many variants! Utterly confusing! N3V Trainz development folks must be on this:

https://getyarn.io/yarn-clip/7041ba40-8012-41bb-905b-ba2c6c58e60e

Rob.

It's really quite easy:

OPTION 1:
Buy a version of Trainz named "TRS YYYY". The smaller the number, the older the version.
(These versions are updated with Service Packs to resolve issues.)

OPTION 2:
Join Trainz Plus Standard or Gold for the latest official version.
Patch using the Beta stream to get the first look at new features before they're ready for prime time.

OPTION 3:
Wait for a new retail version to be released with the newest features (by which time Trainz Plus will have more new features ready to be revealed).

The Alpha I just mentioned is a special case due to the magnitude of the changes and the non-backwards compatibility with any work saved in that build.

Tony_Hilliam said:

Wreeder - please ensure you submit any bug reports. I'd love to know which features you consider Alpha and beta and buggy.

In theory, the "Beta" releases are just that, while the "official" Trainz Plus release is meant to deliver stable, functional, new features.

Albeit those features are generally Phase 1 of a multi-part release schedule in order to get the core feature into the hands of the users for feedback relating to what needs to happen next).

We're preparing our next major release and that will be by way of an "Alpha" given the magnitude of the changes and the high likelihood that all work done in the Alpha build will be throw-away and will not work in future releases.

If you're a Trainz Plus member and would like to be part of that Alpha test, please register your interest here.

Click to expand...

I'm curious. Do you know that I was a beta tester for N3V for about 9 years, TS2009 through TS12 and then tested DLC packages for TANE. I believe I did a pretty good job too. At least I kept getting invited to continue. I found bugs and documented them in detail and submitted reports that got them fixed. I was very systematic about testing all areas of the software and even trying to break the software. It was really a unpaid job in that I often spent 30 to 40 hours a week at it. But it was fun although it did mean that I very seldom got to run the software for just the pleasure of running it.

What do I consider in alpha in Trainz Plus? Well Surveyor 2.0 is still lacking features or some features are not fully implemented. Now, I'll accept the idea that this is phased development as you say. MPS is still in phased development too. Buggy, yes I came across bugs in the limited time I have spent in Trainz Plus this past year. No major or showstopping bugs as they say. I just don't have the desire to spend time looking for repro steps to properly report them. The truth is I rather spend my time in TRS22, TRS19 Platinum and TANE which still work just fine on my old but very reliable Win 7 PC.

Yeah, I'm aware of you abandoning Win 7, odd the most recent version of Trainz Plus and TRS22 both work perfectly with XAudio2 as long as the library is installed. Of course, DX12 is another matter all together. But that is life. My rig meets my needs at the moment for video editing and photo editing. I don't really play the so called AAA graphic games that are so common today. I prefer games that require a strategy to win rather than mindlessly blasting everything that moves. Maybe now that GPU prices are falling, I'll build a new rig to take advantage of the newest AI features in those areas. Messing about with Trainz is always a good way to pass the time while a large video file is rendering.