HD Terrain Discussion Thread

AV3 said:

Apologies if I'm misunderstanding this but does that mean that people who own the normal edition of TRS22 will only be able to use routes with HD Terrain and won't be able to use HD Terrain on their own routes?

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It’s a S20 feature so you’ll need Trainz Plus to edit HD routes.

Tony_Hilliam said:

It’s a S20 feature so you’ll need Trainz Plus to edit HD routes.

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I would also guess that the map file structure would have to be different (i.e. a higher asset build number) which would make it impossible for TRS22 (and earlier) to load routes created with the HD terrain enhanced Trainz Plus. This is not unusual, it has happened before until new SP updates were released to allow other Trainz versions (specifically TRS19) to use the newer file formats.

What is the plan for bringing in real world data such as DEMs?

capdiamont said:

What is the plan for bringing in real world data such as DEMs?

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It’s something we’d love to have in but it’s a bunch of extra work and therefore won’t be in the initial release.

TRS22 will get an update that will allow HD routes to run in TRS22. But Classic tools don’t support HD editing.

Tony_Hilliam said:

TRS22 owners will benefit from the new HD terrain. They won't be able to edit those routes (but can convert to the old grid with some loss of detail and edit in Classic).

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I do apologize if I'm misunderstanding this but will Normal TRS22 Owners only be able to play with routes with HD Terrain and not be able to use HD Terrain on their own routes?

AV3 said:

I do apologize if I'm misunderstanding this but will Normal TRS22 Owners only be able to play with routes with HD Terrain and not be able to use HD Terrain on their own routes?

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Correct, HD is a Trainz Plus feature and will make its way into a future Trainz retail product..

Tony_Hilliam said:

Correct, HD is a Trainz Plus feature and will make its way into a future Trainz retail product..

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Is that also going to be the case for all features that have been announced on the trainz plus website such as DX12 and S20?

AV3 said:

Is that also going to be the case for all features that have been announced on the trainz plus website such as DX12 and S20?

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Generally yes. Major features go into Trainz Plus first. For $8 you can enjoy all the features for a month then decide if you want to continue or not.

Paulsw2 said:

Very much agree with what other posters have said. TransDEM is the best application we we currently have to use accurate DEM data in Trainz. Will the new HD terrain model include a way of generating DEM? If not, then we will have to stick with the 5 and 10m grid in order to be able to generate DEM routes.

I would urge N3V to reach out to Geophil and bring him in as a partner for the new HD terrain - if it comes with a DEM add-on, that would be a huge selling point.

Paul

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Have thought about this a bit more now the alpha is out there and people are trying it out. Could a way round the DEM issue be that you create your route - as a DEM - in TRS22 with conventional grid and then import the route into HD terrain editing which then enables you to do fine tuning of sub-5m terrain detail? ie. you can have best of both worlds?

Paul

Paulsw2 said:

Have thought about this a bit more now the alpha is out there and people are trying it out. Could a way round the DEM issue be that you create your route - as a DEM - in TRS22 with conventional grid and then import the route into HD terrain editing which then enables you to do fine tuning of sub-5m terrain detail? ie. you can have best of both worlds?

Paul

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yes that is useable, however it is a loss of original detail in DEM files. Actually it will be a loss of detail no matter what, however there is less detail loss if we can get a direct conversion from DEMs to Trainz HD.

As this is currently an Alpha and we have no idea what the final grid size will end up as, it's probably to early to think about importing DEMs directly or using Transdem yet.

Lidar does give much better detail in the 5m grid and with HD there is plenty of scope for fine tuning.

I have just now jumped back into Trainz with a purchase of the download TRS22 after being away for several years. TANE was the last thing I had built a route in: a DEM route creation of an actual route in North Carolina from North Wilkesboro to Rural Hall. I have only completed approximately 15-20% of this route and have now loaded it into TRS22 with most everything intact.
Is S20, which I assume is the latest version of Surveyor, available ONLY in one of the recurring subscriptions and NOT in TRS22? If that is true, will S20 ever be available as an update to TRS22?
I see where there is a "Content Samples #1" in TRS22. When I apply some of the ground textures I find in this Sample route into my TANE route in TRS22, they don't look the same. On the PBR Grass textures, the colors are present, but not the blades of grass blowing in the wind. Is there something I'm doing wrong or will these textures not work in my version of TRS22.
If this is in the wrong thread, please let me know.

Thanks.

Okay, I've thought long and hard about this and I'm gonna be as firm but as polite as I can. About the decision to make HD Terrain a trainz plus exclusive feature and save it for a future trainz game, I don't really like this decision. Now, I understand that N3V needs to generate a cash flow in order to keep making these amazing games and if having a subscription service is the way to do that, that's fine. However, I honestly don't think it's fair for normal TRS22 users to only be able to run routes with HD terrain but not be able to edit routes with HD Terrain or be able to use HD Terrain on their own routes without paying the subscription fee. For testing purposes, I can at least understand why it would be a trainz plus in that case, I can say the same thing for most of the new features on the Trainz plus website for that matter. However, I believe that if HD Terrain was ported into the normal versions of TRS22 or if it was ported into a platinum version of TRS22 if there's any plans for that after the testing phases were done on it as well as the other teased features, N3V would more than likely get a major boost in sales on TRS22. I really hope I don't sound ungrateful on this topic, I try not to I love the trainz franchise after all, but I really needed to get that out of my head.

AV3 said:

I honestly don't think it's fair for normal TRS22 users to only be able to run routes with HD terrain but not be able to edit routes with HD Terrain or be able to use HD Terrain on their own routes without paying the subscription fee.

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I have a plus subscription and had the opportunity to try the alpha of HD terrain. At the moment it has not either the dig hole feature so it's not something generally usable. When it will be something more complete it will be a feature for every one. Not it's not.

They are rebuilding the HD Terrain and much more testing is needed. This is a big change so I’m not sure why there is complaints about it not being in the retail version.

Just a quick update for you regarding HD and the next external test. We've been battling with a variety of options to make everything work well together and we are getting closer (much closer). I really thought we'd have something for you last week, but I thought the same thing a few weeks ago as well.

Shouldn't be too much longer to wait.

Thanks Tony. Eagerly waiting for the new version to test