Stingy Creators

Dave does bring up a good point about some creators dictating what can be done with an asset. I am of the opinion that if a person creates content for this game and is freeware, they can't stop others from modifying it.
If anything I am happy there are some creators that allow people to modify or reskin content such as Dave, majekear, whitepass, and others I may not be aware of. Without them creating the originals I wouldn't have stuff to mess around with in Trainz. With majekear specifically, I made myself known over the past year or so by practicing my reskin talents with his numerous autoracks on the DLS. Now there are over 600 reskins of them for people to choose from to enjoy.

With getting permission and the vagueness of licensing from some creators it can be a pickle or a roadblock when it comes to which items to skin. For example, many members here know me for my various reskins of Cloakedghost's 86ft autoparts boxes as shown in the reskin thread. Given he chose to release them as payware over the last few years, it does unfortunately leave me to keep them private due to the vague criteria of the licensing in the config files as far as reskinning them or getting permission to making skins of them freeware.

Hert also brings up a great point about users having to search for third-party missing dependencies for content. They cannot find them due to the missing content being apart of payware content packs, websites that shut down or disappeared, or are on websites/forums where a language barrier is present.

Forester also brings up another reason why some people don't release content (at least on the reskinning side), some people give up on those ideas due to some jerkish behavior from a few individuals. In this space, reskinners all had to start somewhere and it is a skill that takes time to figure out and learn.
 
davesnow said:
Why are there some people out there who create assets, routes, etc. for the game, then deny others the right to use the creations? They want to "keep it for themselves." For heavens sake WHY??! What are they afraid of? Or are they just stubborn and stingy? Makes no sense to me. It's just a computer game. Sure, maybe they did take months and months (years?) to make something, but so what? So what if they release something and someone else changes it around. SO WHAT? I don't understand. We're supposed to be "The Trainz Community." I made thousands of assets but never once did I deny the right for the trainz community the right to play with anything I created. It was all free. And I didn't give a rats ass if someone changed something or reskinned something. It didn't hurt me or foul up my game playing. But there are a few trainzers out there who'd rather never give anything to the community. "It's MINE! It's MINE and you can't have it!!" Sheesh, some people.

Dave
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Take "Kai" (I don't know his Trainz username) on Youtube for example. He makes some great models, but won't release them because he thinks the whole entire Trainz Community is filled with rude people, just because some kid DMCA'd him.
 
As far as I'm concerned anything that I've released onto the DLS is available to be further modded by anyone who wants to do it. If I don't want an asset to be modded it stays on my hard drive, - simple. All I ask is that I'm given a little recognition for my work if the modded item is uploaded to the DLS.
Having once upon a time been ranted at and accused of all manner of heinous crimes by a devotee of a certain little blue engine when he saw a reskin I'd done in a screenshot I have to wonder about some people though. The reskin was entirely for my own private use and had never been shared or uploaded anywhere. It was a nice reskin too and I certainly hadn't set out to demean or besmirch anybodies' work.
 
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d_doll01 said:
Take "Kai" (I don't know his Trainz username) on Youtube for example. He makes some great models, but won't release them because he thinks the whole entire Trainz Community is filled with rude people, just because some kid DMCA'd him.
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His username is Trainman10. I talked with him on Skype when I was briefly part of NARM. He is pretty kind, If you ask me.

chris2001trainz2010 said:
it's important to remember no one is obligated or required to release any of their own assets to anyone
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I was actually going to mention that earlier, but decided to keep my mouth shut since everyone else was arguing otherwise.
 
mbv67 said:
Dave does bring up a good point about some creators dictating what can be done with an asset. I am of the opinion that if a person creates content for this game and is freeware, they can't stop others from modifying it.
If anything I am happy there are some creators that allow people to modify or reskin content such as Dave, majekear, whitepass, and others I may not be aware of. Without them creating the originals I wouldn't have stuff to mess around with in Trainz. With majekear specifically, I made myself known over the past year or so by practicing my reskin talents with his numerous autoracks on the DLS. Now there are over 600 reskins of them for people to choose from to enjoy.

With getting permission and the vagueness of licensing from some creators it can be a pickle or a roadblock when it comes to which items to skin. For example, many members here know me for my various reskins of Cloakedghost's 86ft autoparts boxes as shown in the reskin thread. Given he chose to release them as payware over the last few years, it does unfortunately leave me to keep them private due to the vague criteria of the licensing in the config files as far as reskinning them or getting permission to making skins of them freeware.

Hert also brings up a great point about users having to search for third-party missing dependencies for content. They cannot find them due to the missing content being apart of payware content packs, websites that shut down or disappeared, or are on websites/forums where a language barrier is present.

Forester also brings up another reason why some people don't release content (at least on the reskinning side), some people give up on those ideas due to some jerkish behavior from a few individuals. In this space, reskinners all had to start somewhere and it is a skill that takes time to figure out and learn.
Click to expand...

if you wanted to do public releases of 86ft autoparts boxcars, wouldn't it be ideal to use joram24, davesnow, or dericm's boxcars? (davesnow's are awfully tall though)
 
chris2001trainz2010 said:
it's important to remember no one is obligated or required to release any of their own assets to anyone
Click to expand...

dundun92 said:
I was actually going to mention that earlier, but decided to keep my mouth shut since everyone else was arguing otherwise.
Click to expand...

I don't know why you wouldn't want to add such a comment. Chris200... is correct. Anything you create is yours (unless it is a clone, mod, reskin, etc of someone else's work) and you are under no obligation to release it for others to use.

I am always very grateful to those creators who have uploaded their work for use by others in the Trainz community, even if it is payware, and thankful that we have such people. At the same time I do not criticise those who choose not to freely share their work with others. Nor do I criticise those who decide to make some money from their creations - a lot of time and effort goes into making assets and it is understandable if a creator would want to get some recompense for that effort.
 
schweitzerdude said:
To those people that prefer to keep their own assets to themselves, I will say: Just don't put them on the download station. Problem solved.
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Thats what most of trainz top-notch content creators do, never upload their amazing creations. (Yet people still complain). That's why I tried entering 3d modeling, but found it too difficult. I think the reason people are upset isn't because they are uploading their content to the DLS, but because they can't get the content they want when they want it.
 
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I'm still curious why Dave made his original post and wasn't convinced it was about copyright. Perhaps it was about the Trainz community itself, and the community that existed in the early days of Trainz.

I believe the Trainz community is very strong and, indeed, the primary reason why Trainz has survived so long. Of course there will be exceptions and those who think "what's mine is mine and I'm not sharing". OK, fine, l literally don't care, there are too many fantastic authors and other great members out there who do contribute to the common enjoyment of Trainz. There are many who I would happily call friend even though we have never met.
 
I'm grateful to those who create content for my use and happy to abide by any conditions set. That's a simple solution as well.
 
I used to be quite protective of my routes, but now don't mind if people want to play around with and improve them a bit. The only caveats are that 1. Should not be sold as payware and 2. Somewhere in the readme a passing credit of me as the original author.

What I find more irksome is where stuff is uploaded o the DLS but then needs a host of deps from a third party site to actually work. Most recent example of this is a load of Swedish assets which are on the DLS but incomplete. Posted on the Swedish language forum about this but seems to have fallen on deaf ears. If it's going on the DLS, IMHO all the required deps should be on there, built in or from official N3V DLC.
 
Vern said:
What I find more irksome is where stuff is uploaded o the DLS but then needs a host of deps from a third party site to actually work. Most recent example of this is a load of Swedish assets which are on the DLS but incomplete. Posted on the Swedish language forum about this but seems to have fallen on deaf ears. If it's going on the DLS, IMHO all the required deps should be on there, built in or from official N3V DLC.
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There are several assets by paulhobbs, that have unknown deps (the unknowns are his own assets!), and I have several BR locomotives downloaded that are permanently broken because of that. The same story for the BR 9F. A single missing dep creates a domino effect that breaks like 10 other assets. I'm wondering why I still have these assets in my library...
 
dundun92 said:
I'm wondering why I still have these assets in my library...
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Perhaps in the remote hope that the original creator will release an update that will fix the problem? Assets like that I now routinely delete, they can't be used anyway without the missing assets so why let them fill your CM display with a "sea of red"?
 
pware said:
Perhaps in the remote hope that the original creator will release an update that will fix the problem? Assets like that I now routinely delete, they can't be used anyway without the missing assets so why let them fill your CM display with a "sea of red"?
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Yes, that's it. I've contacted LieLestoSbrat, author of the 9F, via PM about his missing deps, if he could upload them, with all the please and thank you's... with no response. (He's been online several times since I PM'ed him), But as I've said before, no one is obligated to upload missing deps for you. The 9F does appear to be working now though. But the missing deps aren't on the DLS. (Idk how I got them)

I do think the DLS needs a feature/filter/warning that tells you of any unknown deps not on the DLS before you download an asset.
 
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one of the main reasons I don't release my new content is because of my job most of my free time is spent on other projects that take priority over trainz and 2nd is there are "some" ppl on here that don't appreciate "my/others" work and I ran into some real nasty fooks who won't be named, mostly its if I'm in the mood to make content and time. sometimes I may only release content yearly including updates to a map. my stuff is community-free used no permission is needed.
 
I want to push back on this accusation that creators are stingy.

Everything I make is released as soon as it's finished. To save all users the utter drudgery of hunting for missing assets, I put everything on the DLS and they are always for free. The fact that I generally don't want anyone to publish clones/reskins of my works doesn't make me stingy.
 
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