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Thread: Thick forest or thick surveyor? :)

  1. #1
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    Default Thick forest or thick surveyor? :)

    My forest is grinding my framerates to near zero.
    The question I ask is, is it the density or poor choice of tree?
    I am using 'Tree birch Seasonal', fairly dense.
    I am thinking of reducing the density and using a groundcover texture to give it an illusion of density but a change of tree may be helpful.
    TRS19.

  2. #2
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    Load this built-in route in TRS2019 and drive a session: Canadian Rocky Mtns. Plenty of trees. What kind of framerate do you get and how does it compare to your route with the birch trees.

  3. #3
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    I assume you are talking about <kuid2:661281:75024:2> Tree Birch 1 - Seasonal and/or <kuid2:661281:75025:2> Tree Birch 2 - Seasonal by auran and built-in in trs19?

    A quick look in the CM Preview does not show a particularly high poly count for either of these. I have some fairly dense and extensive forests with much higher poly trees and am not seeing such issues but I have not used these particular trees.

    You might try a bulk asset replacement with some billboard tree to see if that helps the frame rate, if it doesn't that may point to some other issue. BTW all the auran birch trees seem to be seasonal fyi.

    <kuid2:523:19723044:1> Tree Birch 01
    <kuid2:523:19723592:1> Tree Birch 05
    <kuid2:661281:75024:2> Tree Birch 1 - Seasonal
    <kuid2:523:1191:3> Tree Birch 02
    <kuid2:523:19723593:1> Tree Birch 06
    <kuid2:661281:75025:2> Tree Birch 2 - Seasonal
    <kuid2:523:1190:3> Tree Birch 03
    <kuid2:565830:100094:2> Tree Birch 02 Snow
    <kuid2:523:1189:4> Tree Birch 04
    <kuid2:523:19723060:1> Tree RiverBirch 01

    Edit: A quick check might be to change the season to winter and see if the frame rate improves noticeably.
    Last edited by normhart; February 12th, 2020 at 01:35 PM.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by schweitzerdude View Post
    Load this built-in route in TRS2019 and drive a session: Canadian Rocky Mtns. Plenty of trees. What kind of framerate do you get and how does it compare to your route with the birch trees.
    Not built-in in my version and not on the DLS

  5. #5
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    You can check performance of each tree in Preview asset > mode > performance analysis, that will fill up a board with trees, use something to measure the FPS, if it drops to near zero its a bad tree, good ones maybe drop the FPS by a relatively small amount.
    Malc


  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by normhart View Post
    I assume you are talking about <kuid2:661281:75024:2> Tree Birch 1 - Seasonal and/or <kuid2:661281:75025:2> Tree Birch 2 - Seasonal by auran and built-in in trs19?

    A quick look in the CM Preview does not show a particularly high poly count for either of these. I have some fairly dense and extensive forests with much higher poly trees and am not seeing such issues but I have not used these particular trees.

    You might try a bulk asset replacement with some billboard tree to see if that helps the frame rate, if it doesn't that may point to some other issue. BTW all the auran birch trees seem to be seasonal fyi.

    <kuid2:523:19723044:1> Tree Birch 01
    <kuid2:523:19723592:1> Tree Birch 05
    <kuid2:661281:75024:2> Tree Birch 1 - Seasonal
    <kuid2:523:1191:3> Tree Birch 02
    <kuid2:523:19723593:1> Tree Birch 06
    <kuid2:661281:75025:2> Tree Birch 2 - Seasonal
    <kuid2:523:1190:3> Tree Birch 03
    <kuid2:565830:100094:2> Tree Birch 02 Snow
    <kuid2:523:1189:4> Tree Birch 04
    <kuid2:523:19723060:1> Tree RiverBirch 01

    Edit: A quick check might be to change the season to winter and see if the frame rate improves noticeably.

    Location is in the northern hemisphere, changed the date to January from June and there was no noticable change in the foliage.
    I have changed to billboard and this gives an improvement. I have never used the performance stats before but one thing stands out - Worst Buffer Count - JVC Grass 407, I suppose it only matters if you use a vast amount.
    From now on I shall construct harvested areas, stumps etc with the forest in the distance for logging routes.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost42 View Post
    Location is in the northern hemisphere, changed the date to January from June and there was no noticable change in the foliage.
    I have changed to billboard and this gives an improvement. I have never used the performance stats before but one thing stands out - Worst Buffer Count - JVC Grass 407, I suppose it only matters if you use a vast amount.
    From now on I shall construct harvested areas, stumps etc with the forest in the distance for logging routes.
    Only really need to worry about worst buffer counts of over 100.
    Malc


  8. #8
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    Where do you find the Preview asset > mode > performance analysis? I'd like to access that. Thanks!

  9. #9
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    Highlight an asset > Right Click > Open > Preview Asset ( bottom of list)

    Or

    Ctrl + Shift + R

    Either method gets you to the preview screen. There are various options on the right hand side to check performance change mode from inspect to performance, you can also check where the lods cut in which is handy when creating stuff.
    Malc


  10. #10
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    Changing to billboards has improved framerates but a big drop in visuals, I can live with framerates down to 12 so will build some example forests and see if I can use a mix.
    Fraps does the job nicely.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost42 View Post
    Changing to billboards has improved framerates but a big drop in visuals, I can live with framerates down to 12 so will build some example forests and see if I can use a mix.
    Fraps does the job nicely.
    Have a look at hminky's new billboards that are using a new mesh / method perfected by jankvis which gives them a better 3d look, leastwise in TANE.

    There are rather a lot of threads so done a search which should cover all his trees. There are 400+ of them Just search on Manage Content for custom > author hminky > on download station they are all prefixed JVC

    https://forums.auran.com/trainz/sear...rchid=10463332
    Last edited by clam1952; February 13th, 2020 at 04:19 PM.
    Malc


  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by clam1952 View Post
    Have a look at hminky's new billboards that are using a new mesh / method perfected by jankvis which gives them a better 3d look, leastwise in TANE.

    There are rather a lot of threads so done a search which should cover all his trees. There are 400+ of them Just search on Manage Content for custom > author hminky > on download station they are all prefixed JVC

    https://forums.auran.com/trainz/sear...rchid=10463332
    Thanks, constructing at the moment, will dive in.

  13. #13
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    One more thing...

    What is your tree detail set at?

    I have found that even with my GTX1080TI, setting the Tree Detail slider to ultra causes awful stutters. Setting the slider to normal results in pretty nice performance.

    To add to this, I come from an area where there's loads of trees and I've tried my best to model this with mixed results in the past. To be honest, I find the Speed Trees to be too nice and perfect, and in some cases too big. Don't get me wrong, they're great around houses, estates, parks, and along boulevards, but for a forest, they're too nice. In the past, I have used billboard trees with mixed results. Some have excellent performance while others will send any machine into a snit due to how they're constructed, and then there's the look as well with some of course being much better than others. I suppose like roads, tracks, and textures, trees too end up on the search for the Holy Grail until we find ones that will truly not only look good but also perform well at the same time.
    Last edited by JCitron; February 14th, 2020 at 01:32 AM.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by JCitron View Post
    One more thing...

    What is your tree detail set at?

    I have found that even with my GTX1080TI, setting the Tree Detail slider to ultra causes awful stutters. Setting the slider to normal results in pretty nice performance.

    To add to this, I come from an area where there's loads of trees and I've tried my best to model this with mixed results in the past. To be honest, I find the Speed Trees to be too nice and perfect, and in some cases too big. Don't get me wrong, they're great around houses, estates, parks, and along boulevards, but for a forest, they're too nice. In the past, I have used billboard trees with mixed results. Some have excellent performance while others will send any machine into a snit due to how they're constructed, and then there's the look as well with some of course being much better than others. I suppose like roads, tracks, and textures, trees too end up on the search for the Holy Grail until we find ones that will truly not only look good but also perform well at the same time.
    Tree detail was ultra - backed off to normal. I have used JVC trees and grass and the framerates stay around 30, small problem is that I have used trees of the same height which looks like a hedge at a distance, a few replacements needed.
    I also added some firebreaks and harvested areas which help.
    The detail is down to my son who seems to think that ultra is 'normal'

  15. #15
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    Landslides, burnt areas, diseased areas, etc. all add character. I use the Ultra tree series. Billboards are never used and the extremely light foliage is not used, especially with white trunks. Obviously limiting the number of mesh files helps. So lots of variety is an issue and really not noticed when you are either riding in a train or following in a "drone". My forests, and routes (only other people's with talent) are of the Northeast USA. Finally. I really dislike the less than subtle brightness of trees that cross that magic LOD value. Also, some background assets can be quite valuable by keeps the FPS down.
    Dick near Pittsburgh, Pa. i5-2500K 4.3ghz, 8gb memory, GTX1060 4gb video card

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