.
Page 7 of 9 FirstFirst ... 56789 LastLast
Results 91 to 105 of 122

Thread: So What's next for Non-Subscription TRS19 Users?

  1. #91
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    West Yorkshire, England
    Posts
    1,660
     

    Default

    I found this discussion very interesting, at first I thought that we were all being steered into an all subscription model but it soon became clear that N3V have merely followed modern practice, is it not the case that younger people want the latest and greatest and prefer to rent as they do with phones, cars, houses whereas the older members have always been used to owning things and accept that they will be out of date as soon as bought. When I first married you rented TVs and later Video Recorders mainly because of the rate of change their unreliabilty and the sheer expense. If you rented you called the shop and they sent out a main with a box of spares to fix the fault. Two years later we upgraded to a colour TV if we had bought a TV that would not have happened. Fifty years later and things have changed, we bought a TV ten years ago and are still happy with it as we can't tell the difference between SD and HD let alone the higher spec.

    I intend to buy TRS19 as soon as the first patch in incorporated into the DVD as my broadband is far too slow to download (1.1 Mbps)



    Ken

  2. #92
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Slovenia
    Posts
    1,453
     

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Swordfish View Post
    I think the subscription with Trainz is the same thing as the subscription of MS Office 365: You will always get the newest stable version. If you will finish the subscription, you have no longer access to the program. If you want to use it furthermore, you have to buy the latest released stable version.

    Just my two cents.

    Regards

    Swordfish



    Something new, Swordfish is the first one who is mentioned quality of products (get the newest stable version). N3V is talking about collecting money and, i admit, they are masters of advertising

  3. #93
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Australia, NSW, Sydney
    Posts
    5,689
    Blog Entries
    3
     

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by celje View Post
    Something new, Swordfish is the first one who is mentioned quality of products (get the newest stable version). N3V is talking about collecting money and, i admit, they are masters of advertising
    I do not understand your point. Since when does Microsoft not collect money - in fact, according to independent industry reports, Office 365 subscriptions have been a huge money earner for Microsoft. Without collecting money N3V would not survive.

    In terms of quality of product, Trainz 2019 is by far the best Trainz version ever released (not just my opinion). The "newest stable version" does not mean "bug free" it simply means what it says - more stable than previous versions and that is certainly true of TRS19.
    A member of the "Party Machine". Now if only I could remember where they are holding the party!

  4. #94
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Slovenia
    Posts
    1,453
     

    Default

    Hello pware

    --''The "newest stable version" does not mean "bug free" it simply means what it says - more stable than previous versions''

    I'm a user, my opinion is simple. For me TS12 is better then TANE and TRS19. Why? In TS12 i run my about 600 km route EUtogether with 16 hours session long without problem. In TANE and TRS19 it's impossible.

    --''Without collecting money N3V would not survive''

    With good work and stable product the sell will be better. It's unpleasant reading months and months that patch will be out soon. (SP4 and SP1 for 19). It's irresponsibility and underestimate of users. Where obligation and duty are? Obviously the advertising is more important.

  5. #95
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    United States of America, Alabama, Birmingham
    Posts
    2,635
     

    Default

    Ok, we have a winner! Yes, the answer is marketing. Clearly the subscription model is not meant for long term users. It is designed to attract gamers. Think about it. Your average gamer buys or rents a game for week and plays it non-stop until they finish it or gets tired of playing. They move on by trading the game in on a new purchase. Just $15 gets you the game for 30 days and access to all the DLC and a first class download ticket. Before the 30 days is up just cancel the subscription.

    Many of us think of Trainz as a construction set for building virtual railroads but how much money is there for that product. Lets say N3V's monthly revenue is $1 million USD. Activision Blizzard is said to have monthly revenue of $1234 million USD for all sources of revenue. They have 37 million subscribers paying at least $10 a month to play all their games. Then add on sales of expansion packs, in game sales and licensing their trademarked images to companies making t-shirts, lunchboxes, posters and anything else you can think of.

    Even though Trainz has always had a close relationship with the community, the future of Trainz is expanding the user base beyond just people with a love for trains.

    William

  6. #96
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    United States of America, Massachusetts, Haverhill
    Posts
    25,394
     

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by celje View Post

    With good work and stable product the sell will be better. It's unpleasant reading months and months that patch will be out soon. (SP4 and SP1 for 19). It's irresponsibility and underestimate of users. Where obligation and duty are? Obviously the advertising is more important.
    I would rather read the patches will be out soon(tm) than have patches released that break things so bad that multiple hotfixes are required to fix the fixes made by the service packs. We've been that route with TRS2004, TS2009, TS2010, TS12, and T:ANE so far. TRS2019 is still new enough to not quite be at that point.

    The thing is if you find a bug report it and don't be afraid if someone else found it too. I'm always reporting bugs and have gotten some things fixed and some rather awful things in the works, but the only way that happens is to report the bugs because the developers only write code, and the QA Team only tests stuff to a point and beta testers only find so much.
    John
    Trainz User Since: 12-2003
    Trainz User ID: 124863
    T:ANE Build: 94829
    TRS2019: 98592

  7. #97
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    United Kingdom, Cheshire
    Posts
    1,166
     

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Hilliam View Post
    What's been improved - we'll get full list together when we have some time.

    PBR - swings and roundabouts. Look fantastic everywhere but the sharp angles. Turning them off is an option.

    Effects tools - updates already well underway and most likely coming Q4 for Trainz Plus members

    Setting a route - I assume you mean the dropdown lists of industries for navigate to versus the mutli-tier approach used previously? Multi-tier has limitations (you can't list more than 20 or so items per tier and 1000 or so items total), and takes up more screen space. The dropdown lists removes those limitations, allows you to filter immediately to your desired destination, eliminates timeout concerns and adds a couple of extra clicks (but replaces a few mouse movements).

    If you mean something else, please explain.
    You got it right Tony, that's what I meant (driver instructions)
    Thank you for your explanation for the changes.

    Pity about the PBR, that was one of the reasons for me buying TRS19.
    I gave PBR a good try, but I eventually turned it off a long time ago, disappointing it was after all the hype.

    I am not going to buy a subscription just to get an early update for Turf FX, the interface should have been simplified before release. I am surprised that it got past the Beta Testers.
    That too is turned off.
    Graham,

    A member of TCWW

  8. #98
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Australia, NSW, Sydney
    Posts
    5,689
    Blog Entries
    3
     

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by celje View Post
    For me TS12 is better then TANE and TRS19. Why? In TS12 i run my about 600 km route EUtogether with 16 hours session long without problem. In TANE and TRS19 it's impossible.
    I rarely use AI in any of my "game play", and when I so it is a single consist under AI control, so that sort of ability is not at all important to me - but I appreciate that for some it is. My criteria are visual quality ("realism" if you like but that is a term that is too often abused), play-ability, the user interface and features. In those areas TRS19 stands alone.

    Quote Originally Posted by celje View Post
    It's unpleasant reading months and months that patch will be out soon.
    As John stated above, waiting longer for SPs that have had the time to be tested and "debugged" is far better than getting them when promised but unfit for use. As many have pointed out Trainz SPs have normally been released on an annual basis so complaining about waiting "months and months" has more to do with unrealistic expectations than practicality.
    A member of the "Party Machine". Now if only I could remember where they are holding the party!

  9. #99
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Port Noarlunga South Australia
    Posts
    1,206
     

    Default

    Well i’m Still using tane sp3, it works ok for me 95% of the time , because all I’m doing is route building , IMO , chasing after perfection is the wrong objective in this hobby .if it works most of the time ,best well leave things as they are, reports of issues with various features of 2019 confirm to me that my decision seems sensible , at least in my set of circumstances .
    Last edited by dangavel; September 10th, 2019 at 06:44 PM.
    WARNING! The Surgeon General has determined that the use of the simulator Trainz is highly addictive,

  10. #100
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Australia, NSW, Sydney
    Posts
    5,689
    Blog Entries
    3
     

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dangavel View Post
    ... IMO , chasing after perfection is the wrong objective in this hobby .if it works most of the time ,best well leave things as they are, reports of issues with various features of 2019 confirm to me that my decision seems sensible , at least in my set of circumstances .
    While I understand your point of view, I have never been a supporter of the view that "if it works well enough then leave it be" or "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". If we had followed that philosophy then we would not have a whole list of features in Trainz, to name just a few that come quickly to mind:-

    • working industries and passenger stations
    • animated semaphore signals (remember the very first ones - the arms did not move!) and junction points (I cannot see why some route creators still don't use them)
    • animated assets
    • LOD
    • Speedtrees
    • ITs and EITs
    • Navigation Points
    • even the much maligned AI was not a part of the earliest Trainz versions


    ... and many others that no doubt others could add. Now I appreciate that these (and other new innovations) are not on everyone's favourites list but they have gone from "new" or "novel" to "mainstream" very quickly.

    Staying with what you are familiar and comfortable with does have its advantages but one thing that I love about Trainz is that each version has brought something new. Yes that sometimes (often) means a new and steeper learning curve but without that challenge I would have found Trainz very boring and would have left long ago.
    Last edited by pware; September 10th, 2019 at 08:08 PM. Reason: typo
    A member of the "Party Machine". Now if only I could remember where they are holding the party!

  11. #101
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Port Noarlunga South Australia
    Posts
    1,206
     

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by pware View Post
    While I understand your point of view, I have never been a supporter of the view that "if it works well enough then leave it be" or "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". If we had followed that philosophy then we would not have a whole list of features in Trainz, to name just a few that come quickly to mind:-

    • working industries and passenger stations
    • animated semaphore signals (remember the very first ones - the arms did not move!) and junction points (I cannot see why some route creators still don't use them)
    • animated assets
    • LOD
    • Speedtrees
    • ITs and EITs
    • Navigation Points
    • even the much maligned AI was not a part of the earliest Trainz versions


    ... and many others that no doubt others could add. Now I appreciate that these (and other new innovations) are not on everyone's favourites list but they have gone from "new" or "novel" to "mainstream" very quickly.

    Staying with what you are familiar and comfortable with does have its advantages but one thing that I love about Trainz is that each version has brought something new. Yes that sometimes (often) means a new and steeper learning curve but without that challenge I would have found Trainz very boring and would have left long ago.
    I’m not against new stuff, I just wait until I have a good reason to believe that my switching to new versions isn’t going to involve me in lots of unwanted angst sorting out a new set of problems . I do have 2019 but i’m not impressed enough by its new features to warrant jumping into using it and I loathe its new interface which is just like Netflix , huge icons that make it hard to find anything in the route section.
    WARNING! The Surgeon General has determined that the use of the simulator Trainz is highly addictive,

  12. #102
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Australia, Qld
    Posts
    5,515
     

    Default

    Lets say N3V's monthly revenue is $1 million USD

    Rofl. Sorry, but's that one of the more amusing guesstimates I've seen. Let's just say "I wish it were true". (The truth is much closer to Swordfishes 2 cents )

    new interface which is just like Netflix , huge icons that make it hard to find anything in the route section.

    If you're not using filters, then there might be a lot of things to look through. Type in the first letter of your route (the cursor is already in the box) and the list is immediately reduced to items starting with that letter.


    Regarding "patches will be out soon" - all we can report is what we know at the time.

    I'm pretty sure we're more frustrated than you guys when it doesn't happen. That said, we're no longer shipping things because we said we would. We're waiting until we're happy with things, then releasing.

    Yesterday was scheduled to be the next update for Trainz Plus beta, but two new issues were identified that we're working on today (one relating to AI pathfinding).
    Last edited by Tony_Hilliam; September 10th, 2019 at 10:11 PM.
    Tony Hilliam

    Got questions about TRS19? Click here for TRS19 FAQs

    Looking for answers to in-game functionality? Click here for help

  13. #103

    Default

    I for one greatly appreciate what you said Tony. No wine before its time. I would rather wait for it to be right as have it right now and be plagued with issues. Maybe if they had worked on the 737Max a few more months they would not be littering the tarmac around the world and costing Boeing and the airlines millions.
    “We are all travelers in the wilderness of this world, and the best we can find in our travels is an honest friend.” ― R.L.S.

  14. #104
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Port Noarlunga South Australia
    Posts
    1,206
     

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Hilliam View Post

    Rofl. Sorry, but's that one of the more amusing guesstimates I've seen. Let's just say "I wish it were true". (The truth is much closer to Swordfishes 2 cents )


    If you're not using filters, then there might be a lot of things to look through. Type in the first letter of your route (the cursor is already in the box) and the list is immediately reduced to items starting with that letter.


    Regarding "patches will be out soon" - all we can report is what we know at the time.

    I'm pretty sure we're more frustrated than you guys when it doesn't happen. That said, we're no longer shipping things because we said we would. We're waiting until we're happy with things, then releasing.

    Yesterday was scheduled to be the next update for Trainz Plus beta, but two new issues were identified that we're working on today (one relating to AI pathfinding).
    I do use filters Tony, but I still loathe the interface , as invariably half the items are still off screen ( and I have 32 inch monitors) I much prefer the old list format, now, if the icon size could be reduced by the user, or one could revert to list, then that would be much more use friendly.
    WARNING! The Surgeon General has determined that the use of the simulator Trainz is highly addictive,

  15. #105
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Australia, nsw, Central Coast
    Posts
    1,511
     

    Default

    I have deleted what i had wrote here because i myself had not done my homework on what N3V have set in place, and a big turn around,,
    Cheers
    Last edited by steve123; September 11th, 2019 at 07:29 PM.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •