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Thread: So What's next for Non-Subscription TRS19 Users?

  1. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by wreeder View Post
    If I get a Trainz Plus subscription does that mean when TRS202x comes out do I get the full retail version? One that I can keep using even if I stop the subscription in the future?
    The subscription grants access to the product. If you end your subscription, you can no longer use that product.

    hth,

    chris

  2. #77
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    Ah, I see. Too bad. I already have the TRS2019 North American Edition. I'll get TRS202x whenever it comes out.

    William

  3. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by WindWalkr View Post
    The subscription grants access to the product. If you end your subscription, you can no longer use that product.

    hth,

    chris
    Maybe you could go about this a better way. Considering that your Trainz Plus members are paying for the development of your software, I think it would be prudent for subscribers to unlock the latest version of Trainz to keep after paying into the program after a pre-determined amount of months.

    It only makes sense to reward your subscribers who are paying for the devlopment with a copy every one in a while. You still end up with the same or more money compared to someone buying it at retail.

    In an ideal world...a lot of things would be different. That's all I'm going to say.
    Last edited by SD45T-2; September 9th, 2019 at 08:43 AM.
    Former Trainz Fanboy

  4. #79
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    @hilliam
    (although it will be a shame is the "mud" sticks as TRS19 is the best version of Trainz and far from mud).


    I
    agree. I will not be using this term, and I hope others will move away from it as well. I am quite satisfied with TANE, but I like some of the routes in TRS19 as well, especially Philskene's.


    I7-8700K
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  5. #80
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    I'm using TRS19 since this spring or so. I must say, I'm truly satisfied so far. It has far less bugs then T:ANE in the beginning. I can only encourage the decision of N3V to take their time for the new update. They seemingly learnt from their mistake with T:ANE. That's good! From my own experience: TRS19 is indeed the most stable and best in performance version so far.

    As for the subscription discussion: it's good that N3V looks further then their backyard as it comes to new marketing strategies. The economic climate changes and N3V just tries to keep up with the time. I might even subscribe to the new Plus subscription. With my subscription, I make sure the game keeps being developed, and maybe they can hire an extra developer.

    Of course, there's always a slight chance things go wrong, but I'd take that chance for granted. Trainz is a part of my life since 2003. I won't abandon this game quickly.

    At last: one thing is for sure: as long as there is an outright version of the game, everything is fine with me.

    Regards,

    Koos

  6. #81
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    Tony's original comment about subscribing to Trainz Plus ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Hilliam View Post
    ... effectively pre-paying for TRS20xx features, and supporting us in getting those features developed, tested and released.
    ... may have opened up a new issue.

    Quote Originally Posted by wreeder View Post
    Here is the question. If I get a Trainz Plus subscription does that mean when TRS202x comes out do I get the full retail version?
    Perhaps Tony's words have been misinterpreted. I would read his statement in the same light as ...

    "Some of the new features in TANE have also been used in TRS19 so purchasing TANE has supported the development of TRS19"

    ...not as the statement ...

    "If you bought TANE you should get a copy of TRS19 for free".

    When TRS19 came out there were some posters who insisted that all TANE owners should get a free upgrade.

    However, the comment ...
    Quote Originally Posted by SD45T-2 View Post
    Considering that your Trainz Plus members are paying for the development of your software, I think it would be prudent for subscribers to unlock the latest version of Trainz to keep after paying into the program after a pre-determined amount of months.

    It only makes sense to reward your subscribers who are paying for the devlopment with a copy every one in a while. You still end up with the same or more money compared to someone buying it at retail.
    ... may have merit but I have no knowledge of the economics of such an option. Perhaps a seamless transition from paying the Trainz Plus subscription to paying the TRS20xx subscription with no price increase may be a more feasible option?

    Just thinking out loud (and I promise not to use the term Mud anymore)
    A member of the "Party Machine". Now if only I could remember where they are holding the party!

  7. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Hilliam View Post
    ...Before it is asked, we don't yet have a planned release date for Trainz 20xx.
    Oh No! Not again! More patches, more fixing of assets, more grief!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkGZ...rt_radio=1&t=0

    I look forward to it - if I live that long and if I can afford it!

    Rob.

  8. #83
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    I would have thought the subscription would fund the entire TRS19 project. Now, I am sure part of the subscription was used for this purpose, but to have a special version with special features for subscribers that will only be seen in the next regular version tells me resources in a small company were split(This is my opinion of course). Would TRS19 be that much better if one of those features were included? Will the way the current subscription process is being used help smooth out the design/coding stage of the next version?

    When it comes to cash flow, I purchased the World Edition. I am guessing the price of this was for the included routes?

  9. #84
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    I think the subscription with Trainz is the same thing as the subscription of MS Office 365: You will always get the newest stable version. If you will finish the subscription, you have no longer access to the program. If you want to use it furthermore, you have to buy the latest released stable version.

    Just my two cents.

    Regards

    Swordfish

  10. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swordfish View Post
    I Just my two cents.
    I have exactly the same two cents.
    A member of the "Party Machine". Now if only I could remember where they are holding the party!

  11. #86
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    [QUOTE=Just my two cents.

    Regards

    Swordfish[/QUOTE]

    My thoughts exactly, although i am not a member paying a montly fee, since i don't need more montly payments with my salary I think for a really complicated piece of software, this is a nice way to generate the development money. After all we still have a choice in this matter. I just have the world version, and it's very stable so far for my needs. (although i have regular spontaneous ctd's when i am doing nothing special) I can live with that. I am still a fan since 2004, and use it on a regular basis. Trs 2019 is my favorite builder ! and the update should come when finished... to many bad memories from the Tane updates. Regards for the Trainz team!

  12. #87
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    Getting back on topic and away from memberships.....

    So the standard non-sub. version purchasers are getting SP1 'soon', that's very welcome, thank you !

    I don't suppose that N3V might give us a hint of what's been improved, no tech explanation, just an outline please.

    Most of the big selling points to me don't live up to the original hype..

    1, PBR ground (even without textures) looks like sliding slime on any embankment next to a railway as you move along in driver mode, very unrealistic.

    2, Turf FX has an unfriendly interface with geekspeak on it. Needs replacing with something that non-geeks can use, e.g, thin grass, tall grass, density etc on sliders.

    3, Setting a route for a driver is clunky and time consuming, needs to revert to the TANE method, although I like the info interface at the bottom of the screen.


    Thanks to all who have contributed here, a very interesting debate it has been!
    Graham,

    A member of TCWW

  13. #88
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    What's been improved - we'll get full list together when we have some time.

    PBR - swings and roundabouts. Look fantastic everywhere but the sharp angles. Turning them off is an option.

    Effects tools - updates already well underway and most likely coming Q4 for Trainz Plus members

    Setting a route - I assume you mean the dropdown lists of industries for navigate to versus the mutli-tier approach used previously? Multi-tier has limitations (you can't list more than 20 or so items per tier and 1000 or so items total), and takes up more screen space. The dropdown lists removes those limitations, allows you to filter immediately to your desired destination, eliminates timeout concerns and adds a couple of extra clicks (but replaces a few mouse movements).

    If you mean something else, please explain.
    Tony Hilliam

    Got questions about TRS19? Click here for TRS19 FAQs

    Looking for answers to in-game functionality? Click here for help

  14. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Hilliam View Post
    What's been improved - we'll get full list together when we have some time.

    PBR - swings and roundabouts. Look fantastic everywhere but the sharp angles. Turning them off is an option.

    Effects tools - updates already well underway and most likely coming Q4 for Trainz Plus members

    Setting a route - I assume you mean the dropdown lists of industries for navigate to versus the mutli-tier approach used previously? Multi-tier has limitations (you can't list more than 20 or so items per tier and 1000 or so items total), and takes up more screen space. The dropdown lists removes those limitations, allows you to filter immediately to your desired destination, eliminates timeout concerns and adds a couple of extra clicks (but replaces a few mouse movements).

    If you mean something else, please explain.
    I bought 2019 (with no subscription) just to support NV3 , I hardly use it and given Macs with decent graphic cards are now all AMD ( my gtx 680 with 2 gb vram is vastly under powered using TANE ,and with my 8gb RX580 i I don't get most of the "benefits" ( or not ) of Turf FX etc.
    However, I am still happy to support the company, but as far as i can see there's not a lot of benefit buying 2019 for current Mac users and even if you support metal in an update , that will not ( i presume ) allow a mac user to use any of the nvidia features. I really cant see how you can continue to support new Mac releases in the future unless you offer something that you can build in to metal that will rival features that are available to PC users.
    WARNING! The Surgeon General has determined that the use of the simulator Trainz is highly addictive,

  15. #90

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony_Hilliam View Post
    Responding here to the OP and a few other points...

    So, what's in store for us poor-relations that dished out a lot of money for the non-subscription version?
    Are we going to get any improvements to the 'game' that we don't have to pay for ?

    The history of Trainz has been that every 1-3 years a new version is released that is sold on the store. Historically we've released a number of Hotfixes (small updates fixing critical bugs) and Service Packs (larger updates primarily focused on bug fixing). This plan hasn't changed.

    The Service Pack referred to in the newsletter is for TRS19 owners. This includes bug fixes but not the new Trainz Plus features.

    As pware eloquently put it:
    "So what if it has been almost a year and still no SP1 for TRS19? That indicates that they finally got the release of a new Trainz product (almost) right - it is not perfect and it has faults but nothing major like the original release of TANE."

    This is one reason things are taking longer to release in this cycle of development. We're not rushing things out the door. We're making sure that they are ready for release.

    We have stated that we have no plans to eliminate the option to purchase Trainz. Nothing has changed in that regard.

    The new features developed that are available to Trainz Plus users have been funded in part by their subscriptions. Purchasers will need to wait and buy the new version that includes the new features. i.e. Improvements and new features that cost money to develop won't be given away.

    We've added a new option for those who don't see value in DLC content to access Trainz Plus on it's own.

    The simple fact is that we are a business addressing a niche market. Spending $2-3 a week to support that business and enable us to become a bigger, better business capable of adding more features more quickly to Trainz, and improving our overall quality, is apparently a proposition many of you reject.

    That's the bit I find hard to figure out. Everyone makes a decision on how to spend $1+ a day on non-essential items. We're talking about 26 cents a day to take up the Trainz Plus option (which includes an FCT that many people do currently see value in).

    If you're happy waiting a few years for updates, then that's fine. If you want updates sooner, then there is an option available for you to access those updates. The choice is yours.


    P.S. I'm keeping DLC out of this discussion for now, but just noting that the rewards program is more about product discounts than content creators. Cayden - perhaps move your most to a new thread as it is worthy of separate discussion.
    If I'm happy to wait a few years that's fine, if I want updates sooner, then I have to pay more. It's my choice.

    You forgot to mention choice #3 - that's the one where I stop supporting N3V.

    When support for TANE stops, my support for N3V does also. It's ridiculous to hold back bug fixes for a couple of years because we didn't buy into the subscription service.

    How's that working out for you - seeing customers leave? Does that help the bottom line as you hoped it would?

    And yes, I actually did try to buy a subscription, however no credit card, no purchase. Don't know why I can purchase anything else in the Trainz Store using my bank card, but not a subscription.

    So I don't even have a choice to purchase if I did want to.

    Thank you N3V.
    Last edited by brucem56; September 10th, 2019 at 05:40 AM.

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