Trainz Plus Update 102894 Ready for testing

Tony_Hilliam said:

Also worth nothing that any terrain changes to a session will be saved in the route. QA looked into this today John and couldn't repro your issue as descibed. If there is another step such something to do with the specific changes made, please include how you load the route, and exactly which tools you use to change which aspects of the route. And probably for completeness, which items affected are in the session layer vs route layer.

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Hi Tony,

Thinking over my processes overnight, I think part of my issue may have been a bunch of things on my part including an old route, however, just as you said I plan on setting up a separate test route and go through the steps. If nothing shows out of the ordinary, then it's definitely a case of iDioT.

Every test version I setup, I create a route called A_TEST_ROUTE for such purposes. This is a native route for the current test version doesn't carry over any baggage from previous testing.

Things appear to work okay in this version so far. Here's a rather busy moment on my Gloucester Terminal Electric. There are trolleys line up and waiting patiently to pull around the loop off, located off to the right, and into Gloucester station while we have a meet between an eastbound freight to Rockport with a westbound to Boston. I had the session running for about 2 hours without a problem until I derailed myself and gave up since it was about 3:00 am and time for bed. There was only a slight stuttering with all this action in this very dense spot.

HPL said:

Just installed two new routes and... where are the default Quick Drive sessions? Session menu is empty!

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In case anyone missed the UDS entry in Wiki - See "changes to existing behavior"
http://online.ts2009.com/mediaWiki/index.php/Unified_Driver_Surveyor

1611mac said:

In case anyone missed the UDS entry in Wiki - See "changes to existing behavior"
http://online.ts2009.com/mediaWiki/index.php/Unified_Driver_Surveyor

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Thanks!

This is a pretty recent addition, and was only an empty page the last time I looked.

Reading through this, I think the issue I reported here was self-inflicted more than being a real problem.

HPL - Thanks for your earlier post. QA have taken a look at each of the issues raised in your post. Firstly can you confirm you're on build 102894.

• Season set to Summer, exiting and saving session, when resumed, it has reset to Autumn on its own (never seen in 100464 and prior).
>>
Unable to repro. This sounds very like confusion between route vs session. Environment settings are saved per session. Edit the session date to summer, save the session, exit, reload, it is still summer. Edit the route to winter, load the saved session, and it is still summer.

• When exiting tunnels, camera climbs 10 meters vertically above the train (no issue in 100464 and prior).
>>
Seems to be fine here. Which camera mode are you in when you enter the tunnel? What camera position when you enter? Does the shape of the terrain above the tunnel effect this? The camera cannot intersect the ground, so if the train is out of the tunnel, the camera will rise above to above the terrain.

• Moving shadows casted by invisible pedestrians remain.
>>
Known issue. It's on our list thanks.

• Several loco lights still visible thru rolling stock textures.
>>
Please provide KUIDs and screenshots to explain the issue in more detail. We need to know is it the lights, the textures, combo of both etc.

• On ECML E-D some gated grade crossings don't work and trains pass thru gates against them (never seen in 100464 and prior).
>>
Please provide KUIDs and screenshots and include nearby named objects so we can track them down (possibly fixed in an upcoming content update).

• Camera angle is higher when a session is resumed than it was when saving (never seen in 100464 and prior).
>>
Please provide repro steps including which camera mode you're in, how you load the session, any camera changes in the session, and how you save (e.g. does it change only if you overwrite for example?)

• Some switchblades still disappear depending on camera angle.
>>
Please provide KUIDs and screenshots. Which angles, does draw distance have any effect?

• "Signal 123456" (more or less digits) still displayed on several signals.
>>
Please provide more information. Is this driver/surveyor/both? Is it all signals? Provide KUIDs and screenshots.

• Frequent CTDs at loading screen when resuming saved games (extremely rare in 100464 and prior).
>>
Please provide reproducible steps so that we can replicate the issue. Does it happen on builtin routes (e.g. test the same steps in the tutorials).
Note: There is a known issue with a crash when loading if the Asset Download window is open.

• Ctrl = (next driver) and Ctrl - (previous driver) don't work (don't remember in 100464 and prior, but work in T:ANE).
Thanks for the report - we can reproduce this bug for Ctrl +. It seems Ctrl - works fine to cycle through the locos. (Ctrl 1-9 also work fine)

Tony_Hilliam said:

Firstly can you confirm you're on build 102894. >>>> Yes.

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• Season set to Summer, exiting and saving session, when resumed, it has reset to Autumn on its own (never seen in 100464 and prior).
>>
Unable to repro. This sounds very like confusion between route vs session. Environment settings are saved per session. Edit the session date to summer, save the session, exit, reload, it is still summer. Edit the route to winter, load the saved session, and it is still summer. >>>> I always set/modify seasons within sessions, never in the route itself. I didn't see this issue since I posted.


• When exiting tunnels, camera climbs 10 meters vertically above the train (no issue in 100464 and prior).
>>
Seems to be fine here. Which camera mode are you in when you enter the tunnel? What camera position when you enter? Does the shape of the terrain above the tunnel effect this? The camera cannot intersect the ground, so if the train is out of the tunnel, the camera will rise above to above the terrain. >>>> Occurs on all routes, all tunnels, whatever camera mode is selected before entering, with every rolling stock. An example: camera position before entering and after exiting:








• Moving shadows casted by invisible pedestrians remain.
>>
Known issue. It's on our list thanks.


• Several loco lights still visible thru rolling stock textures.
>>
Please provide KUIDs and screenshots to explain the issue in more detail. We need to know is it the lights, the textures, combo of both etc. >>>> An example on Sebino Lake route, rolling stock <kuid2:57230:40004:1> FNM DE 145.02, <kuid:69593:70006> FS Carro E (int), both provided with the route:





• On ECML E-D some gated grade crossings don't work and trains pass thru gates against them (never seen in 100464 and prior).
>>
Please provide KUIDs and screenshots and include nearby named objects so we can track them down (possibly fixed in an upcoming content update). >>>> Found it's in fact an image of the closed gate that sometimes fails to disappear on time when train is approaching.


• Camera angle is higher when a session is resumed than it was when saving (never seen in 100464 and prior).
>>
Please provide repro steps including which camera mode you're in, how you load the session, any camera changes in the session, and how you save (e.g. does it change only if you overwrite for example?) >>>> Camera 2, resuming a driver session, no camera changes, new saved game (I never overwrite), here is the camera position just before saving and just after resuming (height and position have changed on their own):








• Some switchblades still disappear depending on camera angle.
>>
Please provide KUIDs and screenshots. Which angles, does draw distance have any effect? >>>> Couldn't find again the exact places, I'll post a screenshot when/if I remember... But it is very rare.


• "Signal 123456" (more or less digits) still displayed on several signals.
>>
Please provide more information. Is this driver/surveyor/both? >>>> Driver. Is it all signals? >>>> No. Provide KUIDs and screenshots. >>>> An example with <kuid:520526:1492> Signal USA L02 NHBC:





Two examples on the built-in route "Cornish Mainline and Branches" with two built-in assets <kuid:46219:24006> GWR Distant (short) and <kuid:4468:25710> GWR Home Left Branch Bracket:





• Frequent CTDs at loading screen when resuming saved games (extremely rare in 100464 and prior).
>>
Please provide reproducible steps so that we can replicate the issue. >>>> As I said: resuming a saved driver session. Does it happen on builtin routes (e.g. test the same steps in the tutorials). >>>> Happens randomly, any route. Note: There is a known issue with a crash when loading if the Asset Download window is open. >>>> No window open.


• Ctrl = (next driver) and Ctrl - (previous driver) don't work (don't remember in 100464 and prior, but work in T:ANE).
Thanks for the report - we can reproduce this bug for Ctrl +. It seems Ctrl - works fine to cycle through the locos. (Ctrl 1-9 also work fine) >>>> Tried it in all routes since I reported with no success. Ctrl 1-9 working fine too (and as I said Ctrl = and Ctrl - work fine in T:ANE).

I've had that problem with the camera (#2) resetting to a higher altitude when exiting a tunnel. Both the entrance and exit are the same height when out of the tunnel and no interaction (by me) with the camera -- just "hands off."

Seasons - fixed? (or repro required if you can get it to happen again)

Tunnel camera - testing here shows the same behaviour in TANE and TRS19. In the example, either the camera has to remain at the tunnel height until the loco and camera clear the hill, or the camera has to embed in the hill. We tried leaving the camera in position until clear of the hill and this behaviour was worse. It only affects things when the camera is well behind the loco.

Loco lights still visible thru rolling stock textures - these are "coronas" rather than "light sources". It's on our to do list to get additional light source support. Meanwhile self-illuminated materials can be used (with some limitations).

switchblades still disappear - I'll await your update

Signal names - that is due to the content creator using "name effect block" since permissive signals in the US and most signals here (Oz) and UK have a number. http://online.ts2009.com/mediaWiki/index.php/Name_Effect

crashing on loading save games - QA cannot repro this, so we'll need to know more about the actions required (while it may appear random, it is likely to be some specific set of content and actions required).

Ctrl+ and - is now fixed in our internal build

Not sure I understand why it's so hard to record the camera height and track altitude just before entering a tunnel and restoring the camera height, +/- any track altitude difference, after exiting the tunnel (at the point where the camera has cleared the overhead terrain)?

Tony_Hilliam said:

Tunnel camera - testing here shows the same behaviour in TANE and TRS19. In the example, either the camera has to remain at the tunnel height until the loco and camera clear the hill, or the camera has to embed in the hill. We tried leaving the camera in position until clear of the hill and this behaviour was worse. It only affects things when the camera is well behind the loco.

Click to expand...

This issue happens whatever terrain is flat or not and with any camera, well behind the loco or not. And did not occur up to Build 100464 and doesn't exist in T:ANE.

Tony_Hilliam said:

Ctrl+ and - is now fixed in our internal build

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Problem is with Ctrl = and Ctrl -.

On ECML E-D (all was fine up to 100464):

I am having another problem saving changes in build 102894.
I have a route and its session running. I decide to make some changes (adding some TurfFx) and straighten some track by going into the surveyor mode and pausing the action. I save the changes - both session and route. I then un-pause the action and go back into the driver mode.
I then exit the game. When I then try to go into the edit surveyor mode (like in build 100464) it starts up in the surveyor mode but everything is running at the same point where I exited in the driver mode. I have to activate the pause mode to get things static.
Am I missing something here. I thought when you started up the game and decided to edit the session that it should come up with nothing running.
I can reproduce this issue every time.

Regarding the tunnels. It appears fine in my version of the route: <kuid2:154322:100063:15> ECML EDINBURGH - DUNDEE

Update: I just thought I'd check the sessions as well, and lo and behold, the sessions are where these tunnel entries are broken. So thanks for your report.

I am pretty sure that the underlying issue here is to do with a bug with digholes that resets the height of nearby objects under certain circumstances. This bug was fixed a month or so ago, so once issues like this are identified, fixed and resaved they shouldn't happen again.

Fwiw, you can fix this one fairly trivially yourself if so inclined. Just edit the session, clone when prompted, use the raise height tool, save. Exit and select your newly saved route and session, then Drive Session and you're away.

Fyi, bug raised here:
Summary: "Tunnel entries near signal E 20 have dropped into the terrain"
Detail:
Tunnel entries near signal E 20 have dropped into the terrain in the three sessions:
<kuid2:154322:100046:9> 1E52 09.10 Dundee - Kings Cross
<kuid2:154322:100244:6> 1S77 23.15 Kings Cross - Aberdeen. The Night Capitals
<kuid2:523:19723760:1> Multiplayer Session

The route itself is fine. <kuid2:154322:100063:15> ECML EDINBURGH - DUNDEE

Paul_Bert

This is correct in that build version as you are editing from driver mode and not the old surveyor mode. That's why after 100464 all saves differ and routes cannot be backward compatible to 100464.

Referring to my post #53 I have done some additional study on the save issue and I think there is a major bug here.

In summary. I have a route and a session. I select "Route" and then"View Sessions" and "Select Session" and then "Edit Session" I do this with a route I have imported from build 100464. The session screen opens up as expected in build 102894 just as it did in build 100464. All the consists are in their default positions when I first built the route/session.

I now run the route for a while and then enable "Pause" and the enable the "Session" so I can make a few changes in the scenary for example. While in this configuration I then hit save and it prompts me to save the route and session. Just like in build 100464.

I then exit the game. I then activate the "Start Trainz" button and once again Select the Route, View Sessions, Select Session, and Edit Session.

When it opens to the session the trains are all running at the same point where they were when I exited the game. I now have to enable Pause to stop all action. if I want to make additional changes to the session without all the consists running about.

But the biggest issue is that the consists are no longer in the same position as when i created the route/session like they were in build 100464.

It appears that when trying to save a session in build 102894 the program is really treating this like I want to save a drive session which I don't want to do.

Tony_Hilliam said:

the sessions are where these tunnel entries are broken. So thanks for your report.

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It seems to be random: today I resumed the session (it is one I created to test rolling stock) and the glitch is gone.

I found another problem on the same route ECML E-D: it is now impossible (was good up to 100464) to put a train on the track on the mainline at southeastern end of the route. All seems to be OK in Surveyor, I save the session, then if I edit it again, the whole train (loco and wagons/coaches) is derailed. I tried with different rolling stock, same issue. If I play the session, train is derailed too. I tried some other places and all is OK.

Paul_Bert

There is no bug, that is how versions after 100464 work. You need to save the original session as base session and then save the working as base session plus 1 or another name. In game saves do not go back to base session but save at point of exit.

Tony_Hilliam said:

Our testing shows the same behaviour now as in TANE, so I am guessing we are trying something different to the test you are doing.

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Performed your tests and got same results in T:ANE and TRS19.

But if I position the camera just above the left track (I never use it 100m behind the train)...

T:ANE:




TRS19:




An example on Sebino Lake route:




As already mentioned, this never happened before I updated from 100464 to 102894.

Something I noticed: in T:ANE camera switching back to its original position at tunnel exits takes one or two seconds, as it is nearly immediate in TRS19.

Tony_Hilliam said:

Signal names - that is due to the content creator using "name effect block" since permissive signals in the US and most signals here (Oz) and UK have a number.

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And the solution to prevent seeing them displayed is?