ATLS Updated for TRS19 Streaming

boat

Active member
All my ATLS assets have been updated to work in TRS19 'Streaming'. They are now on the DLS.

This has meant a major re-write of ATLS to Version 3

Please note that V3 ATLS will not work with older versions so if you download some V3 assets you need to update all the rest on your system too.

Also - ATLS may stop working on existing routes after you update. The most likely reason if this happens is that the ATLS Controller has not been named.

ATLS Controllers MUST have something typed into their name box. If its blank, they will not work. More info - see here www.boatztrainz.co.uk/trs19.html

The new system has legacy calls built-in so 3rd party ATLS assets will work for now but authors should update their scripts to work through the new ATLS Library as soon as possible.

Enjoy,

Boat :wave:
 
I found out the 'hard way' but I assumed that already installed assets would need updating in the route I use them on when I downloaded the V3 assets this morning. It's not a big deal for me, but might come as a shock to some.

Thank you for your hard work on this.
 
Hi John,

Yes, its a bit of a pain but as you probably know its because of the new way of searching for assets and making sure they are loaded, due to the streaming features.

N3V have got round a lot of it by making trackside objects and mocrossings fully autoname. Those objects will be given a name by the game, even on old routes where they didn't have one.
In fact its impossible for trackside items and mocrossing to NOT have a name in TRS19. Unfortunately that doesn't apply to buildable items. So you will have to do the Controllers manually.

I modified the way the Slaves remember things so I don't need to check and load them.... so they don't need to be named. I've only done limited testing in Streaming mode but it should work OK when the game loads them. Time will tell!

UPDATE - Sorry, the old style Slaves DO need to be named!

Best to use the new Slave Trigger!

Regards,
Boat
 
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I am happy to report that the Routes I have created in TANE (most current version), and then uploaded to the DLC, then downloaded to TRS19, still work after updating all the available ATLS assets to V3 (TRS19) assets. I did not have to rename anything or go back and edit anything, and they all retained the channel numbers I gave them. I number all the ATLS assets I use with unique numbers higher than 1000.

I am using TANE build 94916 and TRS19 build 98592 and it all looks rock solid. Thank you Boat!

But I can't tell if I am even in 'Streaming' mode, how do you know, or as a casual user, should I know? There is a good discussion on it here..
https://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?148163-Asynchronous-Route-Streaming

Would a casual user that downloads my route created in TANE, that has the older ATLS Controller V2.7 in it, and they have in there system, the newer controller V3, and is streaming, then will they get this problem? That me, as the route builder, is not going to be able to see?
 
Hi John,

Yes, its a bit of a pain but as you probably know its because of the new way of searching for assets and making sure they are loaded, due to the streaming features.

N3V have got round a lot of it by making trackside objects and mocrossings fully autoname. Those objects will be given a name by the game, even on old routes where they didn't have one.
In fact its impossible for trackside items and mocrossing to NOT have a name in TRS19. Unfortunately that doesn't apply to buildable items. So you will have to do the Controllers manually.

I modified the way the Slaves remember things so I don't need to check and load them.... so they don't need to be named. I've only done limited testing in Streaming mode but it should work OK when the game loads them. Time will tell!

Regards,

Boat

That's interesting how buildable items can't be tracked in the code. I wonder if it's due to too many possibilities therefore too many parts. I noticed the renaming of track-objects and this is most obvious with permissive signals - those that have that small black sign under the signal to place in a name or number. These now have the signal name/number on what used to be a blank sign.

The route isn't too bad because I had already done a grade crossing elimination project on a goodly number of crossings, and raised up the rail line above the roads in many locations. It looks better too and it allowed me to raise up my speedlimit as well - yeah that's the reason why! With about 10 or so left that I couldn't eliminate, this isn't so bad.

I like your Controller-slave because that nifty little asset eliminates the extra clicking on the controller and I can do most of my clicks with the track-object properties.
 
But I can't tell if I am even in 'Streaming' mode, how do you know, or as a casual user, should I know? There is a good discussion on it here..
https://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?148163-Asynchronous-Route-Streaming
I think the idea is that you won't know. When you load a route, if you have streaming enabled and the route is minimum Trainz Build 4.6, instead of the whole route loading in RAM memory, it will only load the local area you are viewing.
As you move around the route, Trainz will stream in more of the route from your hard-drive. Crucially it will also unload assets in areas you have moved away from.... but you shouldn't see any of this.
(It should also load assets near moving trains anywhere on the route). The idea is it makes loading a route faster because its not having to load all of it.
Would a casual user that downloads my route created in TANE, that has the older ATLS Controller V2.7 in it, and they have in there system, the newer controller V3, and is streaming, then will they get this problem? That me, as the route builder, is not going to be able to see?
It depends when you built your route in Tane. The last couple of Controller updates made the asset AutoName. So long as you didn't delete that name it should be fine.
However, any routes using ATLS built before the last month or so will probably have blank Controller names. As a route builder, please check this and give them a name before you upload your route.
Since a build 4.5 won't stream, they should be OK not listing assets, (ref instructions in the Controller asset).
A problem might occur if you have uploaded a build 4.6 route/session (TRS19) built before ATLS V3. Then ATLS assets will need to 'list'. See www.boatztrainz.co.uk/trs19.html
[/QUOTE]

That's interesting how buildable items can't be tracked in the code. I wonder if it's due to too many possibilities therefore too many parts. I noticed the renaming of track-objects and this is most obvious with permissive signals - those that have that small black sign under the signal to place in a name or number. These now have the signal name/number on what used to be a blank sign.
Hi John,
Its not that Buildables can't be tracked. They are in the same boat as the trackside items. The problem is that the old calls to find an asset are no longer reliable. That's because an asset you are looking for may not be loaded, (not streamed).
New calls have been introduced to track assets even if they are unloaded, and to force a load if necessary. But these new calls require an asset to be named.
Trackside items now fully autoname so they will always have a name but Buildable assets have not been given this facility so they can remain blank. With the Controller, I have to ensure it is loaded. When a train hits a Trigger it will call for the Controller to load. Since the Controller might be unloaded I need to find it by the new calls..... so it needs a name.
Not so important with the Slaves as they will get sent messages only if they are loaded.
I like your Controller-slave because that nifty little asset eliminates the extra clicking on the controller and I can do most of my clicks with the track-object properties.
Thanks, I wish I had made this earlier. It's so much easier to set up for Level (Grade) Crossing control and with it having the Slave built in, its less to do too![/QUOTE]
 
I hope you'll excuse a post that may be slightly off topic for this forum, but is there any advantage to updating to ATLS version 3 if one is staying with TANE SP3 (or SP4 if it fixes anything useful)? I've learned the hard way about updating just for the sake of updating, so is this an improvement in any way for us TANE SP3 users or would I be better off staying with version 2?

Thanks,
Lamont
 
Hi Lamont,

If you are using Tane then you can't update to V3. V3 is for TRS19 and above, trainz build 4.6.

If you do get TRS19 I would certainly recommend updating. The calls used in V2 ATLS have been obsoleted in TRS19. They work for the moment but future versions of Trainz beyond TRS19 are likely to see V2 ATLS as faulty.

Also, if you stay with V2 in TRS19, it may not work as expected for streaming routes.

But for Tane, stay with V 2.7.

Boat

PS - (Having said that the new ATLS Driver Commands are trainz build 4.5 which is Tane SP2/3. These are a hybrid and will work with V2.7 and V3. So for them its up to you. You can always delete them and go back to 2.7!)
 
Hi Lamont,

If you are using Tane then you can't update to V3. V3 is for TRS19 and above, trainz build 4.6.

If you do get TRS19 I would certainly recommend updating. The calls used in V2 ATLS have been obsoleted in TRS19. They work for the moment but future versions of Trainz beyond TRS19 are likely to see V2 ATLS as faulty.

Also, if you stay with V2 in TRS19, it may not work as expected for streaming routes.

But for Tane, stay with V 2.7.

Boat

PS - (Having said that the new ATLS Driver Commands are trainz build 4.5 which is Tane SP2/3. These are a hybrid and will work with V2.7 and V3. So for them its up to you. You can always delete them and go back to 2.7!)

Hi Boat,

Thanks for the clarification. I have more of your crossings installed than I can count (and they work beautifully) so I'm glad to hear that I don't need to upgrade them

--Lamont
 
what the hell does "streaming" mean???

I just placed two ATLS crossings in my Cotton Belt Route--- One works fine, the other doesn't. I have checked, re-checked, double-checked, replaced all the ATLS stuff, but one crossing refuses to work. FRUSTRATING
 
Hi Dave,

Streaming is like 'streaming' music or video down the internet. You don't have the whole movie on your computer. You just stream the bit you're watching at that moment. Same with Trainz. You don't have the whole map loaded, just the bit you're viewing at that moment. The problem is, it means half the most popular script calls can no longer be relied on because assets may not be loaded. So a pile of new ones have emerged. Hence the ATLS re-write.
You're probably not streaming TRS19 yet but by all acounts, the next version of Trainz will be doing it all the time! So the ATLS updates are really for survival!

Now why won't one crossing work? Are these old ones from an existing route or new ones you have built since the update? If the former, have you typed a 'name' into the Controller's name box. Also, just check, if you're still using the original Slave, type a name in that too. It shouldn't need it but I may be seeing it does. (Or swap it for the new 'Slave Trigger'.)
Let me have more info on the problem one.

Boat, (Mike)
 
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Hi Dave,

Streaming is like 'streaming' music or video down the internet. You don't have the whole movie on your computer. You just stream the bit you're watching at that moment. Same with Trainz. You don't have the whole map loaded, just the bit you're viewing at that moment. The problem is, it means half the most popular script calls can no longer be relied on because assets may not be loaded. So a pile of new ones have emerged. Hence the ATLS re-write.
You're probably not streaming TRS19 yet but by all acounts, the next version of Trainz will be doing it all the time! So the ATLS updates are really for survival!

Now why won't one crossing work? Are these old ones from an existing route or new ones you have built since the update? If the former, have you typed a 'name' into the Controller's name box. Also, just check, if you're still using the original Slave, type a name in that too. It shouldn't need it but I may be seeing it does. (Or swap it for the new 'Slave Trigger'.)
Let me have more info on the problem one.

Boat, (Mike)




Okay, I figured out what I was doing wrong and have made a piece of artwork to illustrate how I had to set up ATLS in TRS2019. I discovered that you MUST have the Slave attached to a certain Traffic Stopper and Crossing Gate for it to work. You can't mix them. As my artwork illustrates, there are two sides to the crossing (I named them number 1 and number 2) and the two controllers cannot be mixed. In other words (from MY experience) you can't have Slave number 1 trying to control Traffic Stopper number 2, etc. It will not work.

If anyone proves me wrong then I don't know what to say.

 
Hi Dave,

OK, well if you're happy..... But I'm confused! Cos it shouldn't matter.

You didn't say if you were using the new style Slaves or the old 'invisible train' ones. In either case though, one Slave (in theory) could probably do the lot.
It might make more sense to use one Slave to control both Traffic Stoppers and another one to do the 2 Xing Gates. That way you could add a 'delay clear' to the Slave controlling the Stoppers so traffic waits for the xing gates to open.

Another tip is to forget my traffic stoppers. There are several longer versions on the DLS by other authors which will straddle the whole crossing as one. The advantage of just one Stopper is you can't get cars stuck on the wrong side of the it. Search 'Stopper' on the DLS.

Do try not to use the old Slave. The next version of Trainz may well see it become obsolete. Try the new Slave Trigger instead.

See details on the new ATLS assets here - http://www.boatztrainz.co.uk/atls.html and here - http://www.boatztrainz.co.uk/ATLS5.pdf

The new ATLS assets are far easier to set up!

Boat
 
Hi Dave,

OK, well if you're happy..... But I'm confused! Cos it shouldn't matter.

You didn't say if you were using the new style Slaves or the old 'invisible train' ones. In either case though, one Slave (in theory) could probably do the lot.
It might make more sense to use one Slave to control both Traffic Stoppers and another one to do the 2 Xing Gates. That way you could add a 'delay clear' to the Slave controlling the Stoppers so traffic waits for the xing gates to open.

Another tip is to forget my traffic stoppers. There are several longer versions on the DLS by other authors which will straddle the whole crossing as one. The advantage of just one Stopper is you can't get cars stuck on the wrong side of the it. Search 'Stopper' on the DLS.

Do try not to use the old Slave. The next version of Trainz may well see it become obsolete. Try the new Slave Trigger instead.

See details on the new ATLS assets here - http://www.boatztrainz.co.uk/atls.html and here - http://www.boatztrainz.co.uk/ATLS5.pdf

The new ATLS assets are far easier to set up!

Boat




Mike, I thought I was using the latest Slave but apparently I'm not. I thought I had DLoaded all new stuff. I guess I missed that....
 
Dave
Just to clear up your drawing one slave will work. Slave connects to the Xing Gate 1 and then continues to the stopper 1. You don't need to connect the red line to stopper 1 but instead connect to the other Xing Gate 2 and continue to stopper 2.
 
Mike, I thought I was using the latest Slave but apparently I'm not. I thought I had DLoaded all new stuff. I guess I missed that....

Hi Dave,

Yes, just to be clear. There are ATLS updates PLUS two new assets. The V3 ATLS is the update for TRS19 and its new script calls.

However, I have also made 2 new assets. These are a combined Controller/Slave, (kuid:76656:500041) and a Slave Trigger (kuid:76656:500040).
Both these new assets take the form of a trigger so after you download them, you will find them in Tracks/Trackside. They are available in both V2.7 and V3.0.

Both assets can be placed on live track to control a crossing directly. Used with a fixed crossing all you need is the Controller/Slave, (plus the usual green triggers). No extra Slaves. No Traffic Stoppers.
They are much quicker to set up. With a separate asset crossing as you describe above, you can still use the new Controller/Slave on some invisible track but you may need an extra Slave Trigger too.

The Controller/Slave is Level Crossing Mode only so for road traffic light control you will still need to use the original Controller. You should replace the old Slave(TF) with the Slave Trigger wherever possible.
There are some limitations as a few old level crossing will not work with the new assets. For that reason the old Slave(TF) has been updated to TRS19 V3. But it won't last forever.

Boat, (Mike)
 
I'm going to try to figure this out, but it seems a lot more complicated than the old method.

EDIT: NEVER MIND! I got it now. I was using the wrong Traffic Stopper.

Everything is peachy keen now!
 
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Great!

Basically there should be a lot less things to set up if you're using it to control level/grade crossings.

The old/original ATLS was built for complicated road traffic junction control. Using it for crossings was an add on. So you had to figure out which bit of the instructions and which buttons you needed.

The new assets, particularly the Controller/Slave (which is only ever in LCM mode) have been designed with crossings as a primary use.

The only new thing is the way it connects to the crossings. a) - You can choose which crossings it talks to. b) - You may need to add a short piece of invisible track to take the new assets.
In fact in practice, there is usually enough track on the stopper or barrier, so you can probably just plonk the Controller Slave or Slave Trigger on the asset you want to control.

All the best,

Boat
 
Mike, would there be any problem with my creating some longer traffic stoppers and releasing them?

Hi Dave,

No problem at all. But there are already several longer ones on the DLS. PaulzMay has done some, as has Jmann. Plus others. Search 'Stopper' on the DLS.
I didn't bother doing any more because of these.

Boat, (Mike)
 
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