How Does One "Plant" the TurfFX Grass?

E

epa

Angry Trainz Nerd
So I've only had TRS19 for an hour, and I've already run into my first little area of confusion.

I've done some poking around on the built-in routes and the little map demonstrating the new scenery features. One such feature is the TurfFX grass. The thick, wavy, tall stuff. It appears to be part of the PBR ground textures, but laying these same textures does not add the grass. Does it all need to be added manually, or is there just a button I'm missing? Pictured below is what I mean. The grass being used here is "PBR Grass 8 - Seasonal".

The result I'm trying to achieve is on the right. What I get is on the left.

PZIsdmq.jpg


Maybe I'm just missing something...

Thanks
Matt
 
TurfFx is the Grass, the Ground Texture is PBR, not the same thing, you can use TurfFX with existing legacy ground textures or PBR, best to have a look at the tutorial and the examples, it looks a lot more complicated than it actually is.

Tip, if you want too use a TurfFx effect from another route you can screenshot it's TurfFx setting dialog and then use those settings in your route, easier than writing it down.
 
clam1952 said:
TurfFx is the Grass, the Ground Texture is PBR, not the same thing, you can use TurfFX with existing legacy ground textures or PBR, best to have a look at the tutorial and the examples, it looks a lot more complicated than it actually is.

Tip, if you want too use a TurfFx effect from another route you can screenshot it's TurfFx setting dialog and then use those settings in your route, easier than writing it down.
Click to expand...

Which this reminded me to rant to Tony about.. those TurFX settings should offer a 'global' setting or 'default' ones. Then fine tune for the region of the routes grass type. I had to do the same thing you descrbied weeks ago. Take a SS, throw it on 2nd monitor, then copy the settings, each, different grass...

I blame the poor execution and horrible placement of the new TurfFX and Clutter features. Buried so far down a rabbit hole. Executed oh so badly.
 
Kilrbe3 said:
Which this reminded me to rant to Tony about.. those TurFX settings should offer a 'global' setting or 'default' ones. Then fine tune for the region of the routes grass type. I had to do the same thing you descrbied weeks ago. Take a SS, throw it on 2nd monitor, then copy the settings, each, different grass...

I blame the poor execution and horrible placement of the new TurfFX and Clutter features. Buried so far down a rabbit hole. Executed oh so badly.
Click to expand...

Second Monitor used here as well, I agree, things ideally should be labelled as Height, Thickness, Bendyness? is that a word, Colour, area covered, Density.

Things like Int4, Int1 are incomprehensible to most people.

Like the Rabbit hole comparison!
 
Kilrbe3 said:
Which this reminded me to rant to Tony about.. those TurFX settings should offer a 'global' setting or 'default' ones. Then fine tune for the region of the routes grass type. I had to do the same thing you descrbied weeks ago. Take a SS, throw it on 2nd monitor, then copy the settings, each, different grass...

I blame the poor execution and horrible placement of the new TurfFX and Clutter features. Buried so far down a rabbit hole. Executed oh so badly.
Click to expand...

Yup. When all this first appeared I recommended that they supply some presets that we can use. Have the settings built-in for the basics, but editable so we can customize them just like we have for water, sky, and lighting. This was scoffed and fell off in abyss.

I too also complained about the interface being written in "programmer" instead of user. Dealing with binary switches and integer values is fine for the geeks, but not everyone cares, not that they aren't capable, and only want to place grass. Not everyone needs has a PHD in Computer Science, and shouldn't need one to place grass on a Trainz route. This too was met with essentially it's "extra work to give this real names, and take it or leave it".

I have a rather large route I plane to replace the spline grass on when I have time. It ought to be interesting...
 
My first experience with TurFX had grass growing in places I did not plant it, just random grids.

John
 
Since we're still in Beta, I kind of hope the clutter and turf interface is just a proof of concept and not the final design. Following the wiki instructions and after watching the YouTube videos, they are is not hard to place but in game visual could be improved.
 
I gave up on it. Since I drive my locos from the cab I discovered most of these effects can't even be seen from the cab, so I decided it wasn't for me. If they could make the grass and stuff taller or something so I could see it from the cab (AND easier to use) I might go for it.
 
You should be able to see the TurfFx from the cab...

tTdhL6u.jpg


The cab here is the JMB mallet. To be honest, I copied the parameters from the Sebino route to get started which worked well. The geometry-scale parameter sets the height, I made 3 TurfFx layers from .2 to .75. I have to click my LMB 4-5 times to see a result. You can see some of the heavier Clutter layer, too. Don't give up on it. It does get easier to manage.

Best,
smyers
 
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smyers - That looks really good! Inspirational, in fact (like the Sebino Lake examples you modelled it on...)
TRS2019 has the capacity to create superbly realistic trackside vegetation.
All we need to do, is master the arcane UI to take advantage of these new capabilities.
 
Many thanks, PC_Ace. Arcane is a good word for it. Even some of the explanations for it are roughly equivalent to those trig assignments. Once you begin to understand it, the effects can be really nice. There's definitely room for improvement, but it's potential is apparent.
Best,
smyers
 
By the way, the clutter assets can also be used as individual assets, ideal for sticking in between tracks and such.
 
i agree that we need some preset samples to start us off with. Followed the guid sure it aint that hard but im sure a lot of people will not get it, so some example Turfx would be nice
 
I would also say that preset grass settings would be much, much easier to use, and with sliders like in the environment panel.

Also, how do I remove grass/clutter? I wound up with grass and clutter in tracks and roads, even though I didn't actually draw over the tracks and roads.

Matt
 
I wound up with grass and clutter in tracks and roads, even though I didn't actually draw over the tracks and roads.
Click to expand...

This is still an issue with the Clutter and TurfFx effects. Even with the smallest brush size (just large enough that the circle stays white) stray grass and brush can appear widely scattered. I try to observe as closely as possible where stuff is going. If you catch it early, you can use the undo button, too. I've had to delete a layer when I've lost track of where grass or clutter was going. It's kind of a shame because we can't use these effects along a fence or the foundation of a building or between the rails of a branch line. You still need individual assets or spines in those areas. In broad areas though the effects can be striking.

Best,
smyers
 
smyers said:
This is still an issue with the Clutter and TurfFx effects. Even with the smallest brush size (just large enough that the circle stays white) stray grass and brush can appear widely scattered. I try to observe as closely as possible where stuff is going. If you catch it early, you can use the undo button, too. I've had to delete a layer when I've lost track of where grass or clutter was going. It's kind of a shame because we can't use these effects along a fence or the foundation of a building or between the rails of a branch line. You still need individual assets or spines in those areas. In broad areas though the effects can be striking.

Best,
smyers
Click to expand...

I couldn't have said it better.

It really kills the building process/immersion when its time to get fine detail. You can see even N3V run into this issue with their 19 routes. The roadbed and gravel around the tracks is much wider now in all routes, due to TurfFX is my best guess. So much empty space, because you have to account for the brush size and it sticking to a 'square' and not just putting it down where you want. Because you place it in circle, it will spread out. So fences, track sidings, next to buildings, almost all impossible using 2019 features. You must resort to single objects, or old way of ugly grass splines.
 
smyers said:
This is still an issue with the Clutter and TurfFx effects. Even with the smallest brush size (just large enough that the circle stays white) stray grass and brush can appear widely scattered.
Click to expand...
This is probably your Dispersal setting, which behaves very oddly.

It's possible to lay turfx very precisely with a small radius tool and a layer with 1.25m or 2.5m resolution. But if you use any dispersal at all then the effect gets applied outside the area of the tool, but is only visible at a distance! So if you are observing closely as you lay it, you don't see that it's overlaying the track or road or whatever.

I tend to set Dispersal under about 0.05 for any layer that uses high resolution. This also reduces the LOD transition effect. I suspect that the Dispersal parameter is being incorrectly handled when LOD changes.
 
Last edited:
Thanks SailorDan. I'll give it a try. What do you mean by resolution? I don't see a setting for that.

Best,
smyers
 
Last edited:
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