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Thread: Not such a newbie with a peeve

  1. #1
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    Default Not such a newbie with a peeve

    First off, anyone who goes through the trouble of producing a top notch layout and publishes it definitely deserves an atta-boy. If I could personally thank everyone, I would. Whoever produced such layouts as UMR, OOGH, Kiowa, The Rock, SSP, Ashland, Clinchfield, Powder River's, Summer Lake, and that Rocky Mountain High...Wow, you guys are superb.

    Here is the rub. No offense to the creator of the CSX Henderson Sub., but why on earth did you quit on a first class layout? I'm driving my train in some of the most beautiful scenery and WHAM!, my locomotive goes into the river because LP Cut Bank Bridge kuid is missing. Does anyone know how bad of a day the engineer will have with no bridge.

    My beef is this common denominator that plagues this sim. Separating the wheat from the chaff. This community truly has some talented layout builders. But for every one there are six who just want to publish a half done piece of trash and move on to another one. There is absolutely no quality control. Layouts don't have the corner market on this phenomenon, its car and locomotive builders too. Who sells a locomotive that doesn't have all of the dependencies? I can't tell you how many cars I have on the RIP track waiting for some lucky download to come along and spit out a dependency the old car needed to get running.

    Please, if you start something, finish it. Perform a quality check on the thing, and come up with dependencies that work. I'm not a layout guy, and in fact, I couldn't produce a car or locomotive. But I will pay for stuff, and am willing to pay well. I appreciate those folks that can produce high quality realistic stuff.

    Some of us believe publishing a chicken wired layout with a siding and a pretty grain mill put us in the same company as these folks who truly put some effort into some very large and well put together layouts. Let me tell you... take a seat, practice, and come back in a few years. You're not them if you can't finish your work.

  2. #2
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    Default

    Sorry, the OOGH is the GHOO. Credit where credit is due, a very fine layout.

  3. #3
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    He didn't HAVE to give it away as freeware, to you ... Then you would have nothing at all ... never look a gift horse in the mouth

    Perhaps the dependency is missing, or is faulty on your PC

    If you don't like it, don't download it, nor run it ... and go build your own route(s)

    Who appointed you as: "quality control", a judge of "half done piece of trash", "Separating the wheat from the chaff", Who are you to demand "Please, if you start something, finish it, Perform a quality check on the thing, and come up with dependencies that work".

    People who are demanding, will never get my work
    Last edited by cascaderailroad; August 9th, 2018 at 06:57 PM.

  4. #4
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    Default

    Hi EF65,

    I know it can be frustrating, but please understand that a route isn't built overnight: some can take years to build. You often see on this forum people harping on about how long it takes to build a loco, and not to ask because you don't realise how long it takes to build one, and while I completely respect that yes it could take a while, people need to be just as understanding that some routes could take 5, 10 or more years to build. Look at routes such as S&C. I'm sure your missing bridge is just a missing asset, but don't knock route builders in general for one small oversight. Route builders are often a one man team, so mistakes and errors are bound to slip through the net! Anyway, rant over, back to Surveyor I go...
    Cheers

    PLP
    Working to create heritage railways from around the UK for T:ANE.

  5. #5
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    It's the creator's fault you're missing a dependency?

    It's not the route creator's responsibility to make sure you have all the dependencies. It's nobody's responsibility but your own. If you can't find the dependency then you can easily replace the missing bridge yourself. What you're not gonna do is call someone else's work "a half done piece of trash" because YOU don't have all the required items. Now if you were to ask nicely where you could find the missing item, we could help you. But since you're criticizing someone else's work, that was given to you at no cost at all, over something as silly as a single missing dependency, nobody will be nearly as willing to help you.

    Matt
    Last edited by epa; August 9th, 2018 at 07:07 PM.
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  6. #6
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    Did you just lose a locomotive, or was it a whole freight train?

    If it was a whole freight train I think you might have a serious case for the law firm of Dumas and McPhail.
    Toujours Pret!

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazytrain View Post
    Did you just lose a locomotive, or was it a whole freight train?

    If it was a whole freight train I think you might have a serious case for the law firm of Dumas and McPhail.
    Dumas and McPhail, brilliant. I love puns, particularly 'punny' ones. See what I did there?
    Duct tape fixes all problems in Trainz

  8. #8
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    I can see both sides of this debate.

    As a route creator myself (and yes it can take years to build one) I know how easy it is to "slip up" and lose track of what dependencies are built in or on the DLS, and which ones exists only on your PC (been there, done that). So it is (or until recently, was) easy for a route to be released "into the wild" with an asset or two that does not exist, anywhere. At least TANE CM now makes it easy to detect that problem before you upload.

    As a route downloader I also know the frustration of trying to find assets that are not built in and not on the DLS. I gave up doing the "unknown kuid" hunt several years ago. There are sites and threads that will help you but they can give no guarantees and I generally do not have the time. Now if I download a route or session that has unknown kuids I simply delete it and move on.

    I guess this is the price that we have to pay for a game (sorry, a simulator) that has such a wide ranging community of freeware contributors. I would not have it any other way.
    A member of the "Party Machine". Now if only I could remember where they are holding the party!

  9. #9
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    Unless it is a payware route, YOU have no justification to place your blame and criticisms on someones assets ... just because it is on the DLS, doesn't mean that the asset is perfected ... Sometimes you have to fix things that have mistakes ... I would fix the route, instead of just deleting it ... if it has unknown kuids, find them, replace them, or fix them ... If you insist on perfection, then don't even bother to download anything from the DLS ... Unless you yourself are perfect, don't cast stones at others
    Last edited by cascaderailroad; August 9th, 2018 at 08:55 PM.

  10. #10

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    I can see why the OP has made these comments, as he said, he's never tried to make a route.Until you actually try to do so, you have no conception as to how time consuming it actually is.
    in my book, its a bit much to complain about freeware, but that's just typical of certain sections of humanity, they complain about anything , even stuff they get for nothing.
    WARNING! The Surgeon General has determined that the use of the simulator Trainz is highly addictive,

  11. #11

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    Could also be the route was built in an older version of TANE to what the OP (trolling on his 5th post) is trying to run it in and the asset(s) nuked by one of N3V's updates.

    While it is frustrating to download something that doesn't quite work as expected, ultimately freeware is like free advice - worth exactly what you paid for it. The issue of QA or ratings for stuff on the DLS has been done to death and the general consensus was not a good idea as open to misuse from malcontents with a grudge against another creator.

    As a route builder, I will release a project when I believe it's ready which may not be in a state of perfection. The only comment I would add to that, is making sure the description advises if any DLC sourced or external assets are required to run it. Assuming of course the person downloading actually bothers to check the description or included readme.
    TANE...Resistance Is Futile

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by dangavel View Post
    ... but that's just typical of certain sections of humanity, they complain about anything , even stuff they get for nothing.
    Todays generation is spoiled rotten, and expects all things for free, with total perfection, and for it to be working "right out of the box", with all dependencies included

  13. #13
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    FWIW, my pet route keeps losing one particular bridge and I don't know why. This is a route that started in TS06 and still isn't fixed for TANE.

    It's exactly as the OP described - you're driving along and suddenly the bridge, that was definitely there in TS10, is now not there. Yep, its the "missing dependency syndrome" or MDS for short (tm).

    I'm blaming the idiot creator, Hang on, that was me!

    Oh, BTW, the CRG has 676 broken routes on the DLS. You would not believe how difficult those routes are to fix.
    Last edited by pcas1986; August 10th, 2018 at 04:37 AM.

    Paul


  14. #14
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    Just to check this out, I just downloaded and installed <kuid2:107727:1022:2> CSX Henderson Sub from the DLS and there are three missing dependencies:-

    <kuid2:7592:52784:7>
    <kuid2:68787:100904:3>
    <kuid:407646:12001>

    .. and one faulty asset

    <kuid2:76096:100199:1> US Level Crossing Tower

    ... which has 11 warnings and 8 errors - the latter are all VE194: Tag 'texture-kuid' does not contain a valid kuid: null. The "View Help for this [error message]" option in TANE goes to a page that has the totally contradictory and illogical message "There is currently no text for this page"

    Since finding missing assets and fixing that error is not my idea of enjoying a hobby, I will trash the layout and the faulty asset but the installed and working assets that came with the download might be useful.

    Perhaps the OP might do the same and learn from the experience.
    Last edited by pware; August 10th, 2018 at 06:04 AM.
    A member of the "Party Machine". Now if only I could remember where they are holding the party!

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by cascaderailroad View Post
    Todays generation is spoiled rotten, and expects all things for free, with total perfection, and for it to be working "right out of the box", with all dependencies included
    We all know "Perfect" aint gonna happen now is it.

    @EF65 Bro you need to just chill out and listen to what everyone here is saying. No one will just give it to you if your not willing to find what you need then don't bother with it in the first place. I been down this road far too many times.

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