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Thread: North East England - Steam Days Screenshots - Large Screenshots Possible

  1. #601
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    Ah yes! Thank you Border, it's very kind of you for the info.

  2. #602
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    Default The Thompson Twins - It was fifty years ago today.......

    Northeast England just after the age of steam. Here we have two survivors, and to misuse various musical sources, "the Thompson Twins" playing "I'm a survivor" at Newcastle Central circa 1969. Not identical twins though.... The Deal BG, Thompson's Diagram 327 built 1944-46 was a wartime expedient. Its planked body being very different from the usual BG seen on its tracks. Thomspon lengthened his postwar Diagram 344 BG to 63ft. The Diagram 327, which amounted to a build of fifty-three carriages survived the timber-bodied cull of the early sixties because their capacity and speed rating were useful in parcels and newspaper traffic. Several found their way to the Southern Region and others migrated to the London Midland Region. One was captured in both 1969 and 1970 at Stranraer and Crewe respectively.

    Last edited by borderreiver; November 28th, 2019 at 11:27 AM.

  3. #603
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    Default 1919 - N.E.R. Corridor Brake Composite Diagram 174

    Northeast England during the steam era. The North Eastern Railway only ever had a small number of corridor bogie carriages, most to a length over the body of only 53 feet 6 inches. Here is the Corridor Brake Composite to Diagram 174. Three were built during 1909 with four more following in 1912. A final batch of three was built during 1924 by the L.N.E.R. for the GE Section. There were several differences in detail, particularly with the carriage ends on this final batch, but it retained the same Diagram Number as the original N.E. builds.

    Below, the Diagram 174 BCK (2.3) stands at Newcastle with a catering set comprising an Open First, Kitchen/Dining Third and Open Third.










    The BCK, with two First Class compartments and three Third Class compartments found a use on several services. One of them was the overnight through carriage between Newcastle and Shrewsbury, which was attached to several different trains en-route. Post-Grouping the 1926 Carriage Roster has the N.B. Section supplying the daily Glasgow to Scarborough through carriage, but photographic evidence exists showing an ex-N.E.R. Diagram 174 BCK during the period 1923-1928. Whether this was a one-off substitution, a case of the N.B. Section having on its stock a former N.E.R. carriage transferred to Scotland or whether the N.E. Area was more involved in the service than the roster indicates is now unknown. It is another indicator though that the Carriage Rosters lay out a plan of intentions rather than a dliever a "cast in stone" guarantee of what actually happened.

  4. #604
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    Interesting models and narrative there, borderreiver.

    Rob.

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    Default 1919 - N.E.R. Corridor Brake Composite Diagram 174

    Re post #604, thanks Robd.

    I have been ferreting round looking for the N.E.R./L.&Y.R. Newcastle to Liverpool service to see if it used a BCK and I finally found it mentioned in the N.E.R.A. North Eastern Express magazine for May 2018, even though the article was actually centred round the Diagram 159 bogie corridor Brake Van of April/May 1909 ( a very rare beast - only three were built, #405, 406 & 407). No BCK used though, a BFK was used instead, with 2 compartments. There was one N.E.R. set and one L.&Y.R. set, with a change of locomotive at York. The train did not call at Leeds. Departure from Newcastle was at 12:30 p.m. Departure from Liverpool was at 11:05 a.m.

    The N.E. set during the period from 1909 appears to have been a seven carriage set. At Newcastle, from the loco it appears to have been the following:

    BFK Diag 154 (2 compartment. #748 & 1950).
    FO Diag 158 (#1140, 1917 & 2945).
    RT Diag 170 (#1031, 1480 & 1487).
    TO Diag 155 (#388, 501, 649, 848, 991, 1746, 3750 & 3751).
    TK Diag 156 (#36, 181, 256, 262, 293, 311, 790, 792 & 1902).
    TK Diag 156
    BG Diag 159 (#405-7).

    The Diagram 159 BG was assigned to the Newcastle - Liverpool service shared with the L.&Y.R. and Hull - Liverpool service shared with the L.N.W.R.
    The L.N.W.R. took over the L.&Y.R. during 1922, just as the N.E.R. took over the H.&B.R.

    By 1926 and the July Carriage Roster the L.&Y.R. service seems to have disappeared, with the Newcastle to Liverpool service being to Lime Street station and shared on the basis of two L.N.E.R. (N.E. Area) sets and one L.M.S.R. set (carriage rosters 427 427a and 427b. It is noteworthy that by 1926 neither the two L.N.E.R. nor single L.M.S. sets on the Newcastle to Liverpool service include either Dining Third (RT) or Dining Composite (RC) carriages. This would appear to justify the mentioning elsewhere that the L.N.E.R. found that the FO-RT combination was an unusual but useful combination to have on selected expresses. The short FO carriage with the long 12-wheel RT could seat 50 diners, a figure required under L.N.E.R. requirements to suit a 9 carriage set. One example of this between the wars was the 10:10 a.m. London Kings Cross to Newcastle and Edinburgh. With brown teak paint livery applied during L.N.E.R. days they must have stood out when marshalled in the train between Gresley teak stock.

    The disappearance of the L.&Y. joint Newcastle to Liverpool service would also seem to explain the appearance of the Diagram 159 BG in two shots in the RCTS series "Locomotives of the LNER". In Volume 2B and 3C each has one shot of a Diagram 159 BG at the head of a Down express train near Darlington dated to 1923/24. However, in each case the bulk of the train appears to be made up of ex-N.E.R. clerestory roof stock lacking corridor connections.

    For any L.&Y.R. afficionados, the service between Liverpool and York appears to have been in the hands of both Hughes 4-cylinder 4-6-0s and Class 7 4-4-2s (#1424 photographed departing Manchester Victoria with the N.E. set). Sadly, no shots of the L.&Y.R. carriages on N.E.R. metals and no details of which carriages were used in the L.&.Y.R. set.
    Last edited by borderreiver; December 29th, 2019 at 04:19 PM. Reason: More to say

  6. #606
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    Default 1959: 12:30 p.m. Aberdeen to Kings Cross Fish

    North East England during the steam era. In BR days circa 1959 on a summer's early evening the 12:30 p.m. Aberdeen to London Kings Cross speeds south of Acklington station in Northumberland. At this point the A2 4-6-2, in this case Haymerket shed's PEARL DIVER, number 60529, can run at the maximum 75 mph permitted for the express freight. Only passenger trains and express trains will force it off the main line and in to either a loop or siding. The A2 will change at Newcastle, probably for another A2. This will mean hard work for the fireman, since the A2s had a reputation for being "miner's friends", with a heavier appetite for coal than either an A1 or A3 Pacific. On express passenger trains it was not unknown for footplate crew to call at Darlington in an attempt to switch to the standby A3 Pacific loco stationed there to cover for any ailing engine. However, this ploy will probably not work on the district traffic superintendent when hauling an Express freight unless something very visible or very audible is wrong.



    The Blue Spot fish vans are grand new items by Evertrainz.

    PEARL DIVER was allocated to Haymarket (HAY) in February 1948 when new. The shed became 64B in February 1949. PEARL DIVER stayed there until October 1961, shifting to St Margaret's until withdrawal on December 29th 1962.
    Last edited by borderreiver; January 6th, 2020 at 10:45 AM.

  7. #607
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    Default 1914: The N.E.R. 10:00 a.m. Newcastle to Liverpool Lime Street

    Northeast England during the steam era. Edited ----- Examination of the 1912 timetable indicates that the 10:00 a.m. to Liverpool Lime Street (The "L.N.W.R." service) ran via Sunderland, West Hartlepool, Northallerton and Harrogate to reach Leeds New Station. The 12:30 p.m. "L.&Y.R." service) ran via the E.C.M.L. to York. So, my mistake, and the narrative changes.

    Here at the east end of Newcastle Central station the 10:00 a.m. express passenger train for Liverpool Lime Street gets under way. This service has its origins in the mid-19th century, with one daily dining service each way operated as a joint venture between the North Eastern Railway and the London & North western Railway, with one set provided by each company. The northeastbound service departs Liverpool Lime Street at 5:00 p.m. and works back southwestwards the next day at 10:00 a.m. The rolling stock for it has gradualy evolved, until during 1908 the N.E.R. introduced its brand new corridor bogie stock with a fine twelve wheel Restauarnt Dining Third car. The seven carriage set was well configured for First Class travellers, with a four compartment Corridor Brake First and Corridor Open First. There were three Corridor Third Class carriages, one of which was a Corridor Open Third, expanding the capacity for Third Class Diners. The seventh carriage was a Corridor Bogie Luggage Van. The service ran via Sunderland and the County Durham coast route, rejoining the ECML at Northallerton for the station call but then leaving it again to head for Harrogate and Leeds. At Leeds New Station a L.&N.W.R. locomotive would take over for the journey over L.&N.W.R. metals.




    Standing in an east end bay at newcastle with a Z class Atlantic in charge.




    Crossing the east end junction to take the Stephenson High Level Bridge, which, up to 1905, was the only way for the railway to cross the Tyne in the vicinity of Newcastle Central, compelling all Anglo-Scottish trains to reverse in the station. operationally, this was not a tremendous inconvenience, since Anglo-Scottish passenger trains changed engine at Newcastle. What prompted building the King Edward bridge at the west end of the station was the capacity of the High Level Bridge as traffic levels relentlessly increased and there was no way to extend the HLB.

    In the 1912/13 timetable there were two trains between Newcastle Central (N.E.R.) and Liverpool Lime Street (L.&N.W.R.) but only the 10:00 a.m. was a dining car express. The other train left Newcastle at 8:45 a.m. stopping at Darlington (9:30 - 9:34 a.m.) and Harrogate (10:24 - 10:29 a.m.), reaching Leeds new Station at 10:59 a.m. The timetable for the Leeds Northern line northbound shows the 5:00 p.m. from Liverpool travelling via Harrogate but from Northallerton heading for Newcastle via Darlington. working on the assumption that a second northbound train from Liverpool Lime Street ran via Stockton, West Hartlepool and Sunderland, I found three running via the Durham Coast route in each direction! It does not help that the letter G denotes a Saturdays Only train in the southbound table but a through train from Liverpool on the northbound table!! From the timetable it appears to me that while these were through trains to/from Liverpool two out of the three made a lot more stops than the 10:00 a.m. Dining Car Express. The last northbound through train is faster than the others, departing Liverpool at 6 p.m., Leeds New station at 8:05 p.m., Harrogate at 8:45 p.m., Northallerton at 9:30 p.m., Sunderland at 11 p.m. and arriving Newcastle at 11:20 p.m.

    I am not clear if this 6:00 p.m. from Liverpool and 8:45 a.m. from Newcastle were made up of corridor carriages or non-corridor carriages. Even in the early post-grouping era some lengthy train journeys were accomplished in non-corridor stock, though some First Class and Composite carriages had access to lavatories. However, it was not a universal facility on 52ft stock lacking vestibule connections. By the time the 1926 carriage roster was in place the L.&.Y.R. had been taken over by the L.&N.W.R. (1922) before becoming part of the L.M.S.R. (1923) and significant changes had taken place in the Newcastle to Liverpool service.
    Last edited by borderreiver; January 11th, 2020 at 04:19 PM. Reason: Research prompted change of train

  8. #608
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    Default 1914: The 12:30 p.m. Newcastle to Liverpool Exchange

    Northeast England during the steam era. Now that I have determined that the 12:30 p.m. Newcastle to Liverpool Exchange (L.&Y.R.) ran via the E.C.M.L. with the changeover to a Lancashire & Yorkshire Railway engine at York, here are some screenshots of the N.E.R. consist. THE 1912/13 Timetables revealed that there were two N.E.R./L.&Y.R. joint services daily, with two sets provided by the N.E.R. and two by the L.&.Y.R. Unlike the N.E.R./L.&N.W.R. joint service all sets were dining car expresses. There must be a story in there regarding the disparity in passenger facility provision and from the 1926 Carriage Roster it is evident from the consists that dining car expresses were no longer running on the route in the mid-1920s. the L.N.E.R. N.E. Area did introduce buffet cars on part of the journey during the mid-1930s. Therefore, the period immediately prior to WWI seems to have been a "high water mark" for dining car provision on the route.




    Above, passing Croft Spa station on the E.C.M.L.






    Above, crossing the bridge over the Northallerton Road on the south bank of the River Tees in North Yorkshire.
    Last edited by borderreiver; January 11th, 2020 at 04:40 PM. Reason: spelling

  9. #609
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    Couple of questions please.

    What is coach composition.

    What would the L&Y engine type be.

    I will add these to my session workings
    JackDownUnder

  10. #610
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    Good luck with finding an L&Y engine Jack. To my best knowledge there are only two available for Trainz and one of them is payware.

    Another excellent and informative post Frank. And nice screenshots too.
    Narcolepsy is not napping.



  11. #611
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    Agreed. L&Y locos are a bit scarce barring robd's fantastic 4-4-0. As far to my knowledge the only other two are PaulHobbs Aspinall Class 23 0-6-0T and Skipper1945's 0-4-0T Pug - and both are exclusively in BR Livery.

    I have a number of diagrams for L&Y Stock including a diagram of the Dreadnought 4-6-0 but unfortunately I can't do anything with it yet. I haven't reached the level of modeling 4-6-0s yet but maybe one day it might happen!
    Tanker46

    Member of TCWW

  12. #612
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    Paulz Trainz does have a Class 27 model. Payware but it will be worth it

  13. #613
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    I have Paul's one in L&Y livery which is very nice. And of course Rob Dee's lovely 4-4-0. I'd forgotten about Paul Hobb's 0-6-0ST and Skipper's Pug. The question is though, - which one could take the N.E.R.-L.&Y.R. express? (The answer is not the Pug.)
    Narcolepsy is not napping.



  14. #614
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    It would have to be similar to a NER C7 4-4-2.

    I am checking with Paul
    JackDownUnder

  15. #615
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    The L&Y Class 27 is an 0-6-0 goods engine.

    Narcolepsy is not napping.



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