Even if you used the built in Auran stuff? I was thinking that because it is on the DLS and you build a route with what others are offering and then upload it so others can enjoy (you are not charging money after all) that it would not be a problem. I don't know, to me it doesn't make sense that someone would get offended because you flattered them by using their work that they spent time on as part of a route for others to enjoy. As I said, if it were payware then I agree it is a no-no. The rule seems a bit draconian.
Time for a bit of a gripe
- Thread starter Bill69
- Start date
shaneturner12
Tutorial Creator
Indeed. Anyway, it will not let you upload anything to the Download Station that does not have your User ID as part of the KUID.
Be aware that cloning the item will also cause you problems if you try and upload that to the Download Station without the original author's permission.
Shane
Be aware that cloning the item will also cause you problems if you try and upload that to the Download Station without the original author's permission.
Shane
ZecMurphy
Community Assistant
Good Evening All
The 'easiest' way to check if a route will have non DLS dependencies is to download the route first, then stop all subsequent downloads temporarily. Now go to the tab marked 'today', and locate the route, then right click and go to 'view dependencies'. If the route has dependencies that have an unknown location, then it's unlikely they are on the DLS. In this case, simply delete the route.
If it's a small number, it may be worthwhile double checking if they are listed on the DLS website ( http://www.auran.com/TRS2004/DLS.php ), as CM can sometimes miss the odd dependency as being on the DLS...
As to redistributing other people's content, it comes down to simply copyright laws. Most country's laws will protect the author from unauthorized redistribution. Just because the content is free, doesn't mean it's free for you to redistribute. Note, if you do wish to redistribute content, simply contact the author. They may allow it, or they may not. Some author's also include a redistribution section in their content's license
Also, with the large assets. There's another consideration here. Where one tree may be 100+MB, this tree may contain the mesh (and possibly a texture or two) for other tree assets. This can be useful where the trees have common textures (e.g. if you have 5 trees with the same textures /except/ the leaves). You end up with 1 large asset, and 4 minute assets (generally config and thumbnail only!). This actually saves size, but you do end up with some very large files. Same can go for other things (e.g. my current semaphore signal project has a 46MB mesh library, and 102 'signal' assets that are around 120kb; if you only use 1 signal you end up with a large download, but if you use 20 you have quite a big saving ).
That said, it would be preferred to keep file sizes in mind and re-use assets where possible. However, our computer's can handle quite a large variety of assets these days. And this does also improve the visuals in-game. Instead of having 5 identical trees all lined up, the 5 all look different, as they would in nature. Mind you, you definitely need to find a balance in your scene. However, across a large route, a large number of assets is entirely possible and quite likely.
@airtime
This is why we introduced the new DLC system, to make releasing payware add-on routes easier Settle & Carlisle, Murchison 2, Classic Cabon City; they're the first (transferred from earlier add-on releases). We do hope to have more added over time, however these will only be available via the new DLC system. We will be working with the creators, where possible, to help ensure that performance remains satisfactory, depending of course on your detail settings...
Regards
The 'easiest' way to check if a route will have non DLS dependencies is to download the route first, then stop all subsequent downloads temporarily. Now go to the tab marked 'today', and locate the route, then right click and go to 'view dependencies'. If the route has dependencies that have an unknown location, then it's unlikely they are on the DLS. In this case, simply delete the route.
If it's a small number, it may be worthwhile double checking if they are listed on the DLS website ( http://www.auran.com/TRS2004/DLS.php ), as CM can sometimes miss the odd dependency as being on the DLS...
As to redistributing other people's content, it comes down to simply copyright laws. Most country's laws will protect the author from unauthorized redistribution. Just because the content is free, doesn't mean it's free for you to redistribute. Note, if you do wish to redistribute content, simply contact the author. They may allow it, or they may not. Some author's also include a redistribution section in their content's license
Also, with the large assets. There's another consideration here. Where one tree may be 100+MB, this tree may contain the mesh (and possibly a texture or two) for other tree assets. This can be useful where the trees have common textures (e.g. if you have 5 trees with the same textures /except/ the leaves). You end up with 1 large asset, and 4 minute assets (generally config and thumbnail only!). This actually saves size, but you do end up with some very large files. Same can go for other things (e.g. my current semaphore signal project has a 46MB mesh library, and 102 'signal' assets that are around 120kb; if you only use 1 signal you end up with a large download, but if you use 20 you have quite a big saving
).That said, it would be preferred to keep file sizes in mind and re-use assets where possible. However, our computer's can handle quite a large variety of assets these days. And this does also improve the visuals in-game. Instead of having 5 identical trees all lined up, the 5 all look different, as they would in nature. Mind you, you definitely need to find a balance in your scene. However, across a large route, a large number of assets is entirely possible and quite likely.
@airtime
This is why we introduced the new DLC system, to make releasing payware add-on routes easier
Settle & Carlisle, Murchison 2, Classic Cabon City; they're the first (transferred from earlier add-on releases). We do hope to have more added over time, however these will only be available via the new DLC system. We will be working with the creators, where possible, to help ensure that performance remains satisfactory, depending of course on your detail settings...Regards
Dinorius_Redundicus
kuid 68213
If the exact version of a dependency used on a route (as listed in its kuid-table) is not on the DLS, but a higher/later version of the same asset is on the DLS, does CM make the sensible logical connection and list the higher version, or does it register a "?". In other words. do you get a true view of what's really unknown/unavailable? I'm not sure it (I mean CM3.3) does the sensible thing. Please correct me if this is wrong.
Wonderful 2012.
I have just spent hours chasing assets that show they are obsolete, when I try to download the new version the CMP wont download it because it is already on my machine . CMP wont find it and the only way it can be used is to go into the config and make the changes manually. I finally dumped the routes I was trying to download. This is why I spend most of my time using 2010.
Cheers,
Mike
I have just spent hours chasing assets that show they are obsolete, when I try to download the new version the CMP wont download it because it is already on my machine . CMP wont find it and the only way it can be used is to go into the config and make the changes manually. I finally dumped the routes I was trying to download. This is why I spend most of my time using 2010.
Cheers,
Mike
Most Route Builders positively want to share their work. Off and on, the Withered Arm has taken me the best part of ten years to get to it's present stage. Then, you get the frustration because just as you decide it's time to release it, some of the assets that you used are no longer available.
So, you bash off emails to the content creators concerned. The first couple come back "Mailer-Daemon returned to sender - address not found", others never get a reply.
I share the frustration of both the downloader and the author!
So, you bash off emails to the content creators concerned. The first couple come back "Mailer-Daemon returned to sender - address not found", others never get a reply.
I share the frustration of both the downloader and the author!
I knew about cloning and obviously that is wrong, but I am still baffled how someone puts something on the DLS, you use it in a route and it is considering stealing other peoples work for lack of term. So from what others say, I have to contact each person whose asset I use and ask permission to use it in my route before I can upload the route I created? If I am correct then there are a ton of stolen asset routes on the DLS that need to be deleted. My brain hurts.
I already created a thread on this:
http://forums.auran.com/trainz/show...ent-won-t-update-though-updates-are-available
Supposedly Trainz is always suppose to use the most recent version of an asset on your machine if it is newer, but I don't think it is as I have to do the same thing as you.
Some routes have had close to 2,000 assets one Missouri Pacific route was an example. First so many assets slow frame rates. One recent Oz route required almost 1Gb of assets mainly because these were contained in packs just to get a few trees or a couple of pieces of track. I've given downloading any routes because of these reasons and concentrating on my own TRS2006 routes. I've never really bothered getting all assets for the few routes I've DL'd as long as I had the main essentials.
thats the reason i havent played trainz more then a week after purchase, A good remedy would be an option in the user preference, that missing parts are automatically replaced by assets already in the local libary, (so force contend creators to use codes for what the objects are). Also a filter for too heavy an object in this system would be cool, arent computers invented to take such tedious repetitive tasks from us in the first place?, so these slowing down objects are automatically replaced by leaner assets.
just my 2 cnts on this .
just my 2 cnts on this .
thats the reason i havent played trainz more then a week after purchase, A good remedy would be an option in the user preference, that missing parts are automatically replaced by assets already in the local libary, (so force contend creators to use codes for what the objects are). Also a filter for too heavy an object in this system would be cool, arent computers invented to take such tedious repetitive tasks from us in the first place?, so these slowing down objects are automatically replaced by leaner assets.
just my 2 cnts on this .
Not a bad idea, but it can't be automated. How is the program supposed to replace a house with, say, a house? And one that's the right size/style/architecture? A better idea would be a placeholder in Surveyor that states the missing item's name but a user can do a Replace All. There is a round-about way of doing this but it would be good if one did not have to resort to a hack.
The poly load idea has already been floated and N3V has said (I think) that they may implement that in the future, but if the View Mesh Details feature in CMP worked reliably, it might not be necessary.
ZecMurphy
Community Assistant
Hi Chris
I think there's been a bit of confusion
The route itself simply references the content, it doesn't redistribute it. Uploading just the route to the DLS (plus any content you have created of course) is completely fine. If you have modified the content, then of course you need permission to release the modified content.
The issue in discussion here is for content not on the Download Station, which only the original author (or someone with permission from the original author) can put onto the DLS. These non DLS dependencies can't be seen/downloaded by Content Manager. It's this situation that we were discussion redistributing the content. Unfortunately, you either need to include a list of the sites you obtained the non DLS content from in the config.txt (or a separate 'readme.txt' file), or stick with DLS content, otherwise it just becomes difficult to locate the content.
@Dinorius_Redundicus
Content Manager should pick up on these assets, however there are still some cases where it doesn't pick up on the higher 'revision' if the earlier revisions aren't on the DLS. You can skip revisions, but you should always try to have the 'revision 0' (kuid:xxxx:yyyy) on the DLS, that way CM should pick up on the updates.
Note, where routes are concerned, it will normally use the kuid of the installed revision, so should force CM to pick up on it on the DLS.
Regards
silverymo99
New member
I have been making layouts in TRS 12 and I think it is very wise to make layouts of only inbuilt assets, and that would save other users having to down load extra assets, So Auran has been swallowed up by N3V... maybe time for Auran to take over again, remember back when Tri-ang took over Hornby, and then Hornby went back to being Hornby again... I bought a Hornby catalogue lately, to see how much if any of the old 1960's and 1970's stuff was still there in Hornby... Not much at all, only The Horse Box, The Cattle wagon, the 0-6-0 Shunter (like the one Pikkabird has done), and a lot of the old vintage gear from the Tri-Ang Hornby days is now gone. though the rolling stock in Hornhy now is fastly improved from those days, far more realistic.... and I see here in the forum where some members have leamented about the lack of realism of some of the early stuff, that reminds me very much of how Tri-Ang used to call the VR double ended B Class Diesel ( I had one of those), a 'Bo Bo Transcontinental Diesel,wtih TR' (for Transcontinental Railways') instead of VR on it,- when the real thing of VR has a Co Co (three axle driving and trailer bogies... like the Vic 'S' Class.
Tri-Ang were notorious for substituting or generic-ising their Australian Rolling stock back then, and most of it was pretty ordinary stuff, no realisim whatsover!, and I did have a silver ooach that was supposed to represent a Southern Auraura or Indian Pacific coach with a gawdy reid stripe running long the coach at window level.... any one here remember those?....Ghastly indeed... and yes! N scale is not that realistic either because of it's scaled down size. one thing in favour of N scale is that all brands have the same coupling, and you don't have differnet styles of couplings when you buy and mix different brands of N Scale items....like you do if you mix brands of HO/OO, where you get Lima, Hornby, or kadee's (the proper knuckle couplings), and where you would need converter trucks to go between Lima/Marklin and Hornby or Kadee Brand Knuckle Couplered rolling stock....
As I look back and recall, the old Tri-Ang was part of The Cyclops Toy Group, and very much an Aussie equivalent of Tyco.... and very much geared towards the childrens market, where brands like Marklin, Riverossi, Atlas were far superior models... The Tri-Ang arm of Tri-Ang Hornby were also notorious for making a real hash of American stuff too, which goes pretty well to explain why Hornby went back to being Hornby again... and with far superior models....
Tri-Ang were notorious for substituting or generic-ising their Australian Rolling stock back then, and most of it was pretty ordinary stuff, no realisim whatsover!, and I did have a silver ooach that was supposed to represent a Southern Auraura or Indian Pacific coach with a gawdy reid stripe running long the coach at window level.... any one here remember those?....Ghastly indeed... and yes! N scale is not that realistic either because of it's scaled down size. one thing in favour of N scale is that all brands have the same coupling, and you don't have differnet styles of couplings when you buy and mix different brands of N Scale items....like you do if you mix brands of HO/OO, where you get Lima, Hornby, or kadee's (the proper knuckle couplings), and where you would need converter trucks to go between Lima/Marklin and Hornby or Kadee Brand Knuckle Couplered rolling stock....
As I look back and recall, the old Tri-Ang was part of The Cyclops Toy Group, and very much an Aussie equivalent of Tyco.... and very much geared towards the childrens market, where brands like Marklin, Riverossi, Atlas were far superior models... The Tri-Ang arm of Tri-Ang Hornby were also notorious for making a real hash of American stuff too, which goes pretty well to explain why Hornby went back to being Hornby again... and with far superior models....
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Hi Chris
I think there's been a bit of confusion
The route itself simply references the content, it doesn't redistribute it. Uploading just the route to the DLS (plus any content you have created of course) is completely fine. If you have modified the content, then of course you need permission to release the modified content.
The issue in discussion here is for content not on the Download Station, which only the original author (or someone with permission from the original author) can put onto the DLS. These non DLS dependencies can't be seen/downloaded by Content Manager. It's this situation that we were discussion redistributing the content. Unfortunately, you either need to include a list of the sites you obtained the non DLS content from in the config.txt (or a separate 'readme.txt' file), or stick with DLS content, otherwise it just becomes difficult to locate the content.
Regards
Thanks for the reply, I thought about my post last night and then sort of realized this myself and was coming to post on it. So I can upload a route with assets from the DLS no problem and I guess what I was asking isn't possible anyway. I was thinking that you DL the route and then there could be a bundle of the dependencies you used also just like when you back up your route and your dep., this way if I DL route X I can grab the dep. pack too (as long as all content is free and on the DLS) so the route will work correctly. I don't see how this is any different then DLing a route and then going in and getting all the dependencies needed for on from the DLS.
The best solution to a lot of this frustration would be if people would just do what was recommended some time go--there's even a sticky thread for it. Include something like "Some dependencies for this asset are not on the Download Station" in the description. It would save a vast amount of the above-described time and frustration.
In my own case, if I download an asset and find dependencies not on the DLS it immediately goes into the trash.
--Lamont
In my own case, if I download an asset and find dependencies not on the DLS it immediately goes into the trash.
--Lamont