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Vern
September 11th, 2018, 02:22 AM
Okay... we've all been enjoying the Mark One version of TRS2019 for three or four weeks, having paid our premium price $70 or ongoing premium monthly subscription.

Other than a few beta patches nothing new in terms of content or core updates has arrived. A tentative enquiry in another thread about the Canadian route kind of indicated it was some distance off, still. Politely asking then, if N3V can lay out a timeline or roadmap for when they expect the promised routes to start arriving for our purchase along with progress on the core. This doesn't have to be 100% accurate but having shown faith by handing over our money up front, in return a little information wouldn't hurt.

At the moment we have about 20% of what we paid for (or in the case of the subscribers, still paying for).

boleyd
September 11th, 2018, 11:04 AM
The adjustments to TS19 do not seem to be in the major category. Releasing tools, textures and routes that maximize the utility of the product would be nice. But would it be wise. Sort of a yes & no. Yes to keep paying customers happy. There was never any promise that some of the to be released stuff would be out by a certain time frame. Will new routes bring in revenue - yes, Will more waving grass bring in customers? Maybe a few. The other danger is that waiting to fix any issues can be a step backwards. The more you TRY to fix the greater the chance of the opposite. If you fix 20 things and break 5 some disturbance. However if you fix 200 items but break 80 then that is a bad result. I prefer more frequent, smaller, updates with fewer chances for new bugs. Toss in a route with each and you might make less customers unhappy.

martinvk
September 11th, 2018, 12:36 PM
As much as we all would want things now, I think we've see enough examples where a little more time would have delivered better results. And this across all software / platforms. Rushing is never a good idea. Plus making promises and then having to revise them later just results in unfulfilled expectations. :)

Tony_Hilliam
September 11th, 2018, 03:01 PM
Early access is a pre-release version of the software.
The short version of the process that follows is this:
- test the content/code internally
- fix the problems
- retest internally
- determine if the content/code is ready to release for external beta
- if that uncovers no new issues, release a public update.

We’re getting closer to the next content update and when we know the date we will let you know.

Vern
September 12th, 2018, 02:13 AM
Note all that, but the sales pitch for what was the opposite of normal EA pricing was justified by all the content that would be forthcoming. One would have hoped by now at least one of the routes would be ready. Or are we heading into TANE territory where if memory serves me correctly, the final route inventory was rather scaled back from what had been hoped for. Would repeat, not looking for exact dates but to announce particular content would be in the game at least implies the people working on the routes have got them beyond the point of no return pretty much ready to "go", or is the reality people are still beavering away on far from complete projects?

boleyd
September 12th, 2018, 05:38 AM
I remember meetings with Oracle where they would go over the latest bug reports, and the status of each with target dates. Today, such visibility is just about totally absent. Traveling marketing consultants have preached the mantra of say as little as possible to just keep customers at bay. That seemed better than engaging the customers in the fulfillment process. So, we do not know anything as N3V has gone dark at the advice of their favorite marketing consultant.

I have also been on the vendor side of the coin. Making speeches with vague descriptions of advances in the pipeline being only as substantive as needed to retain customer interest. Looking at an audience of blank faces in a fancy ballroom as you drone on, is uncomfortable. I could have changed the expressions to frowns by simply telling them a specific feature planned for release in 30 days may now never see the light of day. You let your sales people slide that reality in front of the customer piecemeal to reduce the shock. As customers of anything we are always being managed. Spoon fed predigested information. Just enough so we do not starve and go to a competitor.

martinvk
September 12th, 2018, 07:52 AM
and so it begins, again. Was wondering how long it would take. TRS19 is not even out in general public release and it's already not good enough. Plus all the dark predictions. Wish my crystal ball was that good.

Vern
September 12th, 2018, 10:18 AM
and so it begins, again. Was wondering how long it would take. TRS19 is not even out in general public release and it's already not good enough. Plus all the dark predictions. Wish my crystal ball was that good.

Something of an over-reaction. Early access is supposed to progressively add to the initial release, after all part of the beta testing we have paid over the odds to do is to ensure the content eventually intended for the public release actually works properly. It was fairly common knowledge there was at least one (German?) route that for some reason never made it into TANE because of an undisclosed issue so it is not unreasonable IMHO to request at the least a broad outline of when this content will start to trickle in. From the POV of those paying subscription (not me I'm happy to say), they are paying the same price for only 20% of the game as they would for the complete package.

I like TRS2019 and aside from a few issues see the potential. However that doesn't stop me from expressing an opinion that not only have N3V turned EA on its head by charging a premium price rather than the reduced charge that slowly increases as features are added, but we have no real information as to when or even if the promised items will be added. As I noted previously, memories of the DTG Flight Sim World EA debacle are still fresh in my mind when ultimately the project collapsed leaving users with an incomplete game, the only redeeming feature being the proper implementation of EA costing which meant it only cost 20.

cashaber
October 14th, 2018, 10:02 PM
the same thing comes to mind. at a hefty $69usd price tag or the $140/yr which I just paid a couple of days ago ( I opted to put my new 1TB SSD drive on hold until next month.) :) I would hope that Nv3 does make some effort into keeping its customers happy. a regular weekly update or at least on your forums would be nice. The price issue is a HUGE concern! do date for a stand alone EA version of the software its by far the most expensive piece of software (non commercial) I have bought. and it does seem as mentioned earlier that's its only 20% completed, which it seems closer to 80% based on features from TANE


here is the quote from thier website,
What is Early Access?
Early Access is a pre-release version of TRS19 which is 99% feature complete and contains a small subset of the final content set. The additional 5 routes will be released throughout the Early Access period and prior to our Q4, 2018 official release.

Claims of 99% feature complete? hmmm not sure if all the driving features make up for 1% or not such as the load/unload commands and just about everything else you can ctrl left click on your engine, Navigate to,drive to, drive to trackmark etc.... I am sure there are behind the scenes stuff to work out but it seems to me to be far less than 99% complete.

Any way I cant wait a couple more months until its full release after all its due out in Q4 2018. my guess is that it will be fully release by Christmas time. :)

Vern
October 15th, 2018, 02:08 AM
Well so far we have had a preview of the Italian route but still no confirmed date. No update to 96000, other than slightly troubling reports that in the ongoing beta releases they are breaking things which work quite well in the original version. (Like AJS stations - a key feature of many routes).


Deadlines, deadlines. Would hope that behind the scenes, N3V are reminding their associates of the commitment they made and that the promised routes are starting to look like vapourware to some eyes.

From N3V's financial POV, there is a huge risk that some of those who took the subscription option, other than the acolytes, may start to question whether it is worth continuing to pay $14.99 a month and not actually have anything new to show for it. I couldn't see Netflix or Amazon Prime getting away with that - how long before people start cancelling and go back to TANE or TS12?

Tony_Hilliam
October 15th, 2018, 03:43 AM
Cashaber - our regular weekly updates are done via the newsletter (sign up at store.trainzportal.com).

Regarding price, this is the same price as Trainz A New Era Deluxe Edition. If we were going to sell 1 million copies, the price would indeed be lower. Looking at it another way, Trainz is one of the the cheapest "hobbies" out there.

Re 99% complete, I don't understand your comments. Are you saying there are bugs with load/unload and ctrl-click? Features missing? Something else? Please provide more info. In terms of feature complete, I'm sticking with 99%. Additional features will begin to be released to Gold Class members next year in our regular updates.

Vern - as I have said elsewhere, we have a choice to release the content updates with a bunch of known issues, or to wait until we've resolved more/most/all of those known issues. There are very few bugs remaining and we're updating and testing daily.

Given that the majority of TANE content can already be imported into TRS19, I'm not sure who is thinking of going back to TANE and/or why. And I think going back to TS12 is a stretch of the imagination.

Regarding the monthly fees, in addition to TRS19 access and an FCT, Gold Class members have been selecting an average of $97 worth of DLC each month to enjoy in TRS19 and many have also been taking advantage of their 25% discount in the store. Whilst the $97 is not what they were likely to have spent in the store, it's still great value for those who enjoy checking out more content.

Vern
October 15th, 2018, 04:47 AM
Well TS12 was a bit tongue in cheek Tony, but how many people looked at the imagery for Canadian Mountains and took the plunge, only to find two months in seems no closer to putting in an appearance?

What about Cornish Main Line, Edinburgh to Dundee or the updated Niddertalbahn? It's not just the routes but the updated (hopefully) 2019 level asset content they will bring in for the route builders - given the lottery that is using older content in TRS2019, as discussed elsewhere.

cashaber
October 15th, 2018, 09:07 AM
@Tony Hi. I was talking about the Navigation to, Drive to, that you can do in tane. so you can have the AI take over etc.... or you may act as a dispatcher. When I left ctrl+ click on the train I get the options to do so but they are all blank and such far they do nothing except display. here is a screen shot for my example. couple does not work as well. as I mentioned before I do not know if these are bugs or have not been attended too

here is the SS url
https://pasteboard.co/HIzz4yO.png

there are also female icons with a guys name?

WindWalkr
October 15th, 2018, 09:13 AM
@Tony Hi. I was talking about the Navigation to, Drive to, that you can do in tane. so you can have the AI take over etc.... or you may act as a dispatcher. When I left ctrl+ click on the train I get the options to do so but they are all blank and such far they do nothing except display. here is a screen shot for my example.

here is the SS url
https://pasteboard.co/HIzz4yO.png

The ellipsis ("…") after the command name indicates that editing will take place after you make the command selection. Switching to Driver Order mode (use the three-dot button in the bottom right) will probably make your life a lot easier.

hth,

chris

Tony_Hilliam
October 15th, 2018, 07:28 PM
For clarity:
- Ctrl-r-click on a loco will bring up the list of Driver Commands (as shown in your image)
- Choosing a command with the ... will add the command to your "Controller Panel" in the bottom right
- From there, click on the command and either choose from the drop down box, or begin typing the name of the object, then select from the list.

Other commands will be updated over time to support the new method. This new system avoids a potentially never-ending search for an item in a very long list, avoids nested heirachies, and improves performance (no stalls while the searching is going on).

"couple does not work as well" - we have no report of couple not working. Testing here shows it is working as expected in a simple test case. If you have a case where it is not working, please check if it is specific to the loco/rolling stock/location/something else.


how many people looked at the imagery for Canadian Mountains and took the plunge, only to find two months in seems no closer to putting in an appearance?
Well, it will be two months in a week today and we're much, much closer. In fact, I fully expect the majority of builtin content will be released by then.

Having said that, I also expected that we would have released at least a couple of the routes by now. I'm not sure what else I can say other than we're working on it.

Btw, the latest beta does have quite a large number of new TRS19 assets including a huge range of JR buildings, track, locos and rolling stock.

Vern
October 15th, 2018, 07:53 PM
Having said that, I also expected that we would have released at least a couple of the routes by now. I'm not sure what else I can say other than we're working on it.

Now I can't get the image from Return Of The Jedi out of my head, when Darth Vader admonishes the officer in charge of building Death Star Mk2 about the lack of progress - "The Emperor is not so forgiving as I."

'nuff said for now then, let's come back to this at the end of November and see how things are shaping up...

dangavel
October 15th, 2018, 09:04 PM
Nobody forced any of those who are griping to buy the pre-release , i learned my lesson after shelling out for the pre release TANE . Now I never jump on board a new release, whether it be an operating system or an app , I wait until some of the worst bugs are ironed out.

Why not run trains in SP3 if the new release hasn't got enough features to engross your interest . Or you could meditate and hone your patience skills , or even better, make some assets for 2019 if you are bored..... :-)

cashaber
October 15th, 2018, 09:44 PM
I was in the wrong mode as seen in the ss. they all seem to be working now that I selected the correct mode to be in.

I hope you include all the JR items that you can grab they are very well made and really detailed :)

I also hope that you include the odometer in with the distance bar its always nice to see how far your train has driven (mostly for route testing purposes.)

Do you guys have an estimated release date?

Tony_Hilliam
October 15th, 2018, 10:45 PM
Estimated release date remains Q4 2018 ;)

The exact date will depend on the rate of identifying and fixing remaining issues until we're happy that the build will be "ready".