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andi06
July 14th, 2015, 06:33 AM
The error in referencing *.tga when *.texture.txt exists seems to be causing a lot of grief. For existing assets why don't you just rewrite the config in this case?

WindWalkr
July 14th, 2015, 07:39 AM
Rewriting the config might be possible, but isn't entirely trivial (there are assorted edge cases that we'd want to handle.) The primary reason we don't perform config rewriting is that we don't offer any form of asset "fixing" tool. The options that we have available are:

* Ignore the problem, and (if necessary) work around the issue at runtime.
* Show a warning, and (if necessary) work around the issue at runtime.
* Show an error and refuse to load the asset.

None of these actually modify the files on disk. That's not to say we couldn't go there, but it's basically outside the remit of any of our current tools (and more like the kind of thing that AssetX does.)

chris

andi06
July 14th, 2015, 08:02 AM
I will include it in the automatic fixes the next time AssetX gets updated but if you have enough technical knowledge to understand and use AssetX then this issue is trivial anyway.

If you don't (and the vast majority of users posting about it obviously fall into this class) then it is giving a disproportionate amount of grief. I would have thought that it would be trivial for you to use *.texture in lieu of *.tga if both are present.

WindWalkr
July 14th, 2015, 08:22 AM
The trivial solution is likely wrong in some cases. How often? I don't know. That's why we don't mess around with that kind of thing.

It's the same reason we don't tend to automatically generate a black texture when someone references a nonexistent "black.texture". Would it remove a lot of error flagging? Yes. Would it silently introduce a lot of bad behaviour? No idea. Could do.

For something like AssetX, the user is expected to at least have a basic idea of what they're doing, and they definitely have the idea that *something* is being changed. If we did it transparently, a whole different class of user is involved, and it's likely to be completely transparent even to power users.

There are definitely arguments for having something like this, but I don't think that building it into the validation process is the way to go, and it would be very easy for us to mis-step so I don't want to rush off and implement quick fixes unless we've demonstrated that other approaches don't resolve the problem over time.

chris

andi06
July 14th, 2015, 09:01 AM
If I were in your seat I would be saying much the same thing but it doesn't alter the fact that the error and subsequent failure of the asset is very bad news for a lot of users, many of whom don't post in, or even read, the forums. What is bad for these users is bad for you.

There must be a way to reduce the incidence of this kind of thing but I don't know what it is offhand either. :-)

clam1952
July 14th, 2015, 09:18 AM
Trouble is any fixing requires users to actually know what they are doing, For me easily done for the tga in config when there is a .texture present, I just opened them all for edit and did a batch text search and replace, very quick, not going to pacify the masses though.

If there was a way of tracking these problem assets down easily perhaps they could be added to the repair program maybe in a separate section?

Pencil42
July 14th, 2015, 09:32 AM
I noticed this wasn't flagging an error in 77010, it had been downgraded to a warning.

Curtis

JCitron
July 14th, 2015, 10:03 AM
Trouble is any fixing requires users to actually know what they are doing, For me easily done for the tga in config when there is a .texture present, I just opened them all for edit and did a batch text search and replace, very quick, not going to pacify the masses though.

If there was a way of tracking these problem assets down easily perhaps they could be added to the repair program maybe in a separate section?

I agree. This is an easy fix for those in the know, so to speak. For the rest of the general users, this is fodder for bad press as they claim T:ANE is broken, it killed my assets, blah, blah, blah.

We have to keep in mind that not everyone is a Trainz Geek! :D

John

ps. I'm downloading the 77241 build now. I will check later after I pick up my new eyeglasses which I will treasure dearly. They cost me $850 with a discount!

Dinorius_Redundicus
July 14th, 2015, 12:19 PM
There must be a way to reduce the incidence of this kind of thing but I don't know what it is offhand either. :-)

An error message that didn't require translation from code-monkey gobbledegook and even suggested one or two likely fixes would help. Programmers should try thinking as newbies instead of technicians and Trainz would be a lot easier on the rest of us.

Mick_Berg
July 14th, 2015, 12:44 PM
I agree. This is an easy fix for those in the know, so to speak. For the rest of the general users, this is fodder for bad press as they claim T:ANE is broken, it killed my assets, blah, blah, blah.

We have to keep in mind that not everyone is a Trainz Geek! :D

John

ps. I'm downloading the 77241 build now. I will check later after I pick up my new eyeglasses which I will treasure dearly. They cost me $850 with a discount!
Holy crap! Have you heard of Zenni Optical?
Mick.

JCitron
July 14th, 2015, 12:52 PM
Holy crap! Have you heard of Zenni Optical?
Mick.
I'm blind and require special prisms and other doodads. :)

It makes for frustrating reading when text is the size of ant footprints.

Back to topic:

I installed and crashed the new version.. Off to test something else and crash that too.

John

Mick_Berg
July 14th, 2015, 11:51 PM
I'm blind and require special prisms and other doodads. :)

It makes for frustrating reading when text is the size of ant footprints.

Back to topic:

I installed and crashed the new version.. Off to test something else and crash that too.

John

Sorry to hear that John. These people wouldn't be much use to you, I fear. Very basic stuff made in China.
But the price is right, you can get a pair of serviceable glasses from a prescription for under ten bucks.
Outrageous pricing came to me in the form of a single injection during my cancer treatment, six hundred dollars for one squirt.:'(
Mick.

pcas1986
July 15th, 2015, 12:28 AM
I agree. This is an easy fix for those in the know, so to speak. For the rest of the general users, this is fodder for bad press as they claim T:ANE is broken, it killed my assets, blah, blah, blah.

We have to keep in mind that not everyone is a Trainz Geek! :D

John
...

I'm going to echo my agreement with this as well and add that not everyone is a computer geek. There have been countless times I have recommended AssetX to users and many simply think it too daunting to use. Perhaps there is scope for a simpler utility for fixing the texture problem without invoking the power of AssetX.

There is a thread running about a utility to go and modify an IM file to change a material name. As a guy who used to write assembly language programs for a living, that got my interest, but even I would tread carefully with that one. :D

Pencil42
July 15th, 2015, 12:35 AM
I noticed this wasn't flagging an error in 77010, it had been downgraded to a warning.

Still not an error in 77241. So, since it looks like this won't be an error anymore, end users probably won't need to fix it, and we won't need some sort of auto-fixit utility.

Curtis