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View Full Version : Chris or any of you learned creators would liike to reply?



VinnyBarb
June 4th, 2015, 12:38 AM
I posted this thread about T:ANE patch 76536 (http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?120090-T-ANE-Patch-76536-is-this-really-it-Surely-not) in the T:ANE forum. Does anyone else see what I am seeing there when placing TS12 content in it and getting somewhat different looking content out of it.

Thank you for any replies.

VinnyBarb

WindWalkr
June 4th, 2015, 08:03 AM
It's not immediately clear to me what's going on in your screenshots. Maybe somebody else has some input? You might want to break it down into a series of problem descriptions, since you seem to be collating many screenshots with what appears to be unrelated symptoms.

One possibility is that some of this relates to the normal-map tangents thread in this forum, but i'm not really sure, and some looks definitely unrelated.

chris

VinnyBarb
June 4th, 2015, 04:49 PM
It's not immediately clear to me what's going on in your screenshots. Maybe somebody else has some input? You might want to break it down into a series of problem descriptions, since you seem to be collating many screenshots with what appears to be unrelated symptoms.

One possibility is that some of this relates to the normal-map tangents thread in this forum, but i'm not really sure, and some looks definitely unrelated.

chris

First, it is the very obvious texture degradation now taking place in TANE 76536.

Second it is the display of the normal mapping effect being "too loud", like looking now to be very overdone with the same normal maps being used.

Third, the very jagged shadow borders one can see now.

As I took screenshots of the textures now showing in TANE 76536 and while these other issues were also noticed in some of these screenshots, it is only prudent to ask for explanations or solutions for these as well while I only wanted initially to highlight the very obvious texture degrading issue in TANE 76536. Saves me of posting several different threats and pictures and posts and for you having to answer all over the place in the forum when this can be explained in one single thread here.

OK, what is happening in these screenshots is, the same texture mapped assets with the same texture maps being used in all these Trainz versions getting displayed differently texture wise in different versions of TS12, TANE 75947 and TANE 76536. Especial the way the same textures like, say, the diffuse TGAs and the normal maps now look and operate completely different in the latest TANE 76536 version I have for testing. In other words, these textures are now getting degraded quite a lot and especial with normal mapping now working completely different as this used to work from TS09 onwards. Or even in older versions of Trainz.

Why would this now be so different in TANE 76536 when someone, I think it was you who said some time ago, quite a lot of the old code was ported over or used in TANE. Meaning most of the way these things were operating, might/could/should reasonably do similar now. Beside, this all was still looking good and reasonable appearing in TANE 75947 and all previous versions of TANE, only you would know what has changed since then. Perhaps what you might call a performance "optimization" being done? Care to please enlighten us?

VinnyBarb

WindWalkr
June 6th, 2015, 05:54 AM
First, it is the very obvious texture degradation now taking place in TANE 76536.

Interestingly, in the first two screenshots, it actually looks like T:ANE is showing the texture at higher detail. That's clearly not desirable in this case, but it looks like TS12 might be the one that's actually blurring the image- if so then it's likely an accidental outcome of the texture streaming algorithm in TRS2009-TS12. Of course I may be completely misreading what is happening in those screenshots, but that's how it looks to me.

In the third screenshot, everything is very blurry- I suspect that you've got post-processing turned up to full and that you're standing very close to the loco, resulting in a deliberate blur being applied. Have a play with the post-processing settings and see if that makes the blur go away; if it does, then this is a deliberate effect.



Second it is the display of the normal mapping effect being "too loud", like looking now to be very overdone with the same normal maps being used.

T:ANE is basically a lot better at normal mapping than TS12 was. I'm open to feedback from other people, but since it's basically correct as is, I doubt we'd want to change it even if it is visibly more prominent.



Third, the very jagged shadow borders one can see now.

Hard to say for sure, this is one that we'd need to play with the content in question a lot, but this is probably just the natural outcome of the shadow technique in use. To some extent the quality of this will depend on your hardware (nVidia does a few things that ATI can't do, for example) and to some extent this will depend on your shadow resolution in the game settings. There is always going to be an upper limit on shadow resolution, so if you're standing very close then you'll always see some amount of pixelation.

chris