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hotgrove
June 10th, 2013, 12:16 PM
I got disheartened with this a couple of years ago and just gave up on it....however......I've had another go......spent the whole afternoon reading the tutorials and carefully following instructions to set up a simple junction......the lights are changing in sequence but the traffic wont stop when the lights go red..........spent hours doing various adjustments but to no avail............am i still making a basic error somewhere......i have been setting up my junction with great care.

Williamb73
June 10th, 2013, 01:58 PM
There is a whole bunch of stuff for setting up junctions and signal on Google.

H222
June 10th, 2013, 04:21 PM
Have you got traffic stoppers, and triggers?

hotgrove
June 10th, 2013, 04:55 PM
Yes I have.......i'm concentrating on getting the traffic right and eventually have a basic junction working properly.....two problems though......no matter what I do I can't get the cars to stop in the right place.........also can't seem to get a dual carriageway to work...........probably a lot of trial and error before I figure it out.

stagecoach
June 10th, 2013, 05:21 PM
A simply crossroads = 2 traffic stoppers, 2 slaves, 1 controller plus traffic lights. Connect an East - West road to the traffic stopper and do the same with the North - South road with the second traffic stopper. Select track and place invisible track from the slave to the stopper, one slave for each stopper. Position the stoppers across each other to give you the crossroad effect. Place traffic lights where you want them.
Select properties of controller and select channel, select routes 2 and phases 2, route 1 red and green, route 2 green and red (leave the spl alone).
Select properties of slave and select the same channel as controller, select route 1 repeat for second slave but select route 2.
You need to remember which slave route you attached to the East - West road stopper.
Select properties of the traffic light that faces the East - West and select the same channel and route as the slave. Repeat with the North - South traffic lights and match the second slave.
For example controller on channel 1
East - west slave Channel 1 route 1
Traffic lights channel 1 route 1

controller on channel 1
North - South slave Channel 1 route 2
Traffic lights channel 1 route 2

Don't put a road spline to near the traffic stopper as cars will over run them.

hotgrove
June 10th, 2013, 05:46 PM
Thanks for that stagecoach.....these are the exact same steps I took in setting up a basic junction......I've now got that working and just a bit of tweaking is required..........the more complicated ones are giving me bother........still unable to get adjacent lanes of traffic coming from the same direction.........as i said earlier,a lot of trial and error before I conquer it.

hotgrove
June 11th, 2013, 08:22 AM
I hate being a thicko and a pest at the same time........I know that each junction has its own channel number.............If traffic designated as route 1 passes through a junction (channel 1) and approaches another junction (channel 2).......does the route number have to be changed for it to work with this junction and further junctions or will the same route number suffice ?

boc61
June 11th, 2013, 08:55 AM
If you don't mind, I have a missing dependency issue with an ATLS item, so I figured I'd post here rather than start a new thread. This is in regards to the ATLS Inverse Slave. It shows a missing dependency, Invisible Train. That item shows Update available, but I can't seem to get any update for it.

shaneturner12
June 11th, 2013, 08:56 AM
boc61: There is a well known issue involving that specific asset, which boat is trying to resolve.

Shane

boc61
June 11th, 2013, 09:37 AM
Thank You, Shane.

shaneturner12
June 11th, 2013, 09:38 AM
No problem. By any chance have you had unexpected derailments?

Shane

boc61
June 11th, 2013, 10:23 AM
Not as of yet. I may not have come across that particular item in any routes as of now.

stagecoach
June 11th, 2013, 05:26 PM
Each Channel is self contained so the route number does not matter, your choice. Sometimes two junctions near each other could be controlled by one channel. North/South being the main route could use route 1 while any East/West roads joining could be route 2 and/or 3. There is no end to possible set ups for junctions.

hotgrove
June 12th, 2013, 04:16 AM
Thanks again Stagecoach.....appreciate the help......yes,i do see that the route number doesn't matter, however yet another problem has arisen........no matter how close or far I insert a spline point to the traffic stopper....the traffic ALWAYS shoots beyond the mark........I've tried it in numerous positions but nothing works.

boat
June 12th, 2013, 08:40 AM
Hotgrove....

If the Invisible Train is a missing dependency, then traffic will never stop. The current problem with the Slave and invisible train should not show as a missing dependency. Problems only occur when saved games are restored, otherwise it should still work.... BUT you need the Invisible train. If its missing and won't download, you could try a manual download from here.... https://www.auran.com/TRS2004/DLS_viewasset.php?AssetID=157240 . Go to Download Page, then Download via Direct ftp Link.


Are you running SP1 on your TS12? I'm suspecting that the current Slave problem Shane mentioned may be from SP1 only. (Its just because the kuid of the Inv Train was changed - not a problem with SP1)

I will be issuing a new Slave and INV Train soon but still waiting for a reply from the Helpdesk for clarification before I do.

Anyway, Hotgrove. you must have the Inv Train on your system and the Slave showing no missing dependencies for it to stop cars.

Cheers,

Boat

mcguirel
June 12th, 2013, 08:42 AM
I find this system an utter pain and while it is nice not worth the effort. Why it is so popular is beyond me.

hotgrove
June 12th, 2013, 10:03 AM
Thanks for that boat.....I have the junction working in principle......the traffic is stopping in turn,just not where it shoud be.......I tried that link but no response...........I do like the system and see it as a necessity for my tram routes...........i'm running Trainz 2009.....have never downloaded any service packs from day one.

nicky9499
June 12th, 2013, 11:27 AM
Thanks again Stagecoach.....appreciate the help......yes,i do see that the route number doesn't matter, however yet another problem has arisen........no matter how close or far I insert a spline point to the traffic stopper....the traffic ALWAYS shoots beyond the mark........I've tried it in numerous positions but nothing works.

You should try removing the spline point altogether. Just connect the road directly to the traffic stopper and let it work its magic.


I find this system an utter pain and while it is nice not worth the effort. Why it is so popular is beyond me.
Definitely agree it is very troublesome to set up. But the pros far outweight the cons. For starters: road at any angle, any gradient, and width and any crossing board you can dream of. Main course: control multiple roads, multiple tracks, sidings, have different trigger distances for fast and slow trains. Dessert: wide variety of crossing gates, gantries and accessories and customizing of bell mode and durations. As Stagecoach said, the possibilities are endless, so IMO it is definitely worth the effort.

Unless of course you were building a model railroad, then that would be overkill.

hotgrove
June 12th, 2013, 12:01 PM
I know what you are saying Nicky but you need the spline point for attaching the invisible road at the pedestrian crossing........the junctions don't look natural with road lines running through them..........Since the invisible roads have traffic I was thinking of maybe doing the whole route like this then going over it all with road lines with no running traffic which would allow me to leave the appropriate areas blank........double the work but just a thought.

stagecoach
June 12th, 2013, 06:21 PM
For junctions and roads I use MGreen48 ones. Use the road with markings up to about 4 grid squares from the centre of the junction and then link the two sides with the unmarked road. All you need do then is add the road markings for the stopping area of the crossing or even add a road island. Other roads are available that come unmarked as well as marked. Spline points need to be at least 20m, more if possible, from the stopper.

hotgrove
June 13th, 2013, 02:05 AM
It wont work for me anyway stagecoach......no matter where i insert a spline point the traffic still shoots beyond the crossing.......boat has stated that i require the invisible train but i'm unable to download that asset.........a good system but it wont work for me.

boat
June 13th, 2013, 02:51 AM
It wont work for me anyway stagecoach......no matter where i insert a spline point the traffic still shoots beyond the crossing.......boat has stated that i require the invisible train but i'm unable to download that asset.........a good system but it wont work for me.

I'm not quite clear whether you are saying cars will not stop in the correct place... or they will not stop at all?

If they won't stop in the correct place then you may need a Stopper on BOTH sides of the crossing. It they won't stop at all, then it's the lack of Inv Train which is on the DLS and you should be able to download. The link I gave you works for me but you need to be logged in to Auran. Go to https://www.auran.com/TRS2004/DLS.php and log in your user name and password if you have not already done so. Then 'search' for Invisible Train. (Tick the TRS 2004 box first). Have you registered your copy of TS 2009?

Don't be put off by what people say about Service Packs. While they can be frustrating to install and stop some assets working, (almost all because the asset had a problem in the first place), the Service Pack will improve your product. The base TS 2009 had many issues and is vastly improved if you install all the packs! (Including CMP issues).

I will be updating the Slave and Inv train soon so wait for that if you like.

Boat

hotgrove
June 13th, 2013, 06:57 AM
I'm using the same method of stopper placement you recommended in your tutorials........and yes....the traffic does stop in turn but no matter what I do with the spline points the traffic ALWAYS over shoots the crossing.....moving the stoppers as you suggested does nothing i'm afraid............the ATLS stopper and slave are now showing as red in my surveyor list...........I will look out for any updates and will reluctantly have to abandon it at this time......haven't given up for good though.....thanks for the help.

boc61
June 13th, 2013, 02:21 PM
I'm not quite clear whether you are saying cars will not stop in the correct place... or they will not stop at all?

If they won't stop in the correct place then you may need a Stopper on BOTH sides of the crossing. It they won't stop at all, then it's the lack of Inv Train which is on the DLS and you should be able to download. The link I gave you works for me but you need to be logged in to Auran. Go to https://www.auran.com/TRS2004/DLS.php and log in your user name and password if you have not already done so. Then 'search' for Invisible Train. (Tick the TRS 2004 box first). Have you registered your copy of TS 2009?

Don't be put off by what people say about Service Packs. While they can be frustrating to install and stop some assets working, (almost all because the asset had a problem in the first place), the Service Pack will improve your product. The base TS 2009 had many issues and is vastly improved if you install all the packs! (Including CMP issues).

I will be updating the Slave and Inv train soon so wait for that if you like.

Boat

Looking forward to that update as I'm using TS12 with SP1 and all hotfixes and the invisible train won't show. CMP says it's installed but it still lists as a missing on assets that require it.

boat
June 13th, 2013, 05:06 PM
Looking forward to that update as I'm using TS12 with SP1 and all hotfixes and the invisible train won't show. CMP says it's installed but it still lists as a missing on assets that require it.

Hi boc61.... Well that's a new one. The main problem I have found is regarding the update of the Slave/Inv train by N3V in TS 12, (just SP1 I think - I'm also running SP1 with HF3 so can't tell if it was there before). More info here..... http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?102242-ATLS-Question&highlight=ATLS

I am still waiting to hear from the Help Desk for some clarification. I'll give them another day or so but if nothing then I will update in the way I think will work best. Probably an issue 2 for the Inv Train and an issue 7 for the Slave. In fact most of my ATLS assets will need to have an 'update'. The Controller and Triggers on TS 12 SP1 are not the same as the same number kuid on the DLS. Script is improved on the DLS version! The new Inv train and Slave etc will be Trainz Build 2.9. Hope it sorts your problem too!

Boat

boc61
June 13th, 2013, 05:18 PM
It's really strange . If you bring up the Slave in CM, it shows as missing and on the DLS. If you drag it to the download box is shows the update available icon, but no updste downloads. All the while if you search for it in CM it shows as installed and error free.

stagecoach
June 14th, 2013, 03:14 AM
This might be because the kuid table refers to the older style kuid number but trainz is looking at the newer kuids. What ive done in the past is alter the kuid table of an asset to read kuid2 numbers and not kuid numbers. I believe trainz sees the older number as kuid2:***:***:1.

boat
June 14th, 2013, 03:27 AM
Hi Keith,

Well Trainz should see a base kuid as kuid2:***:***:0 but its all very odd! Changing the kuid-table entry of the asset using the Invisible train to the actual kuid of the invisible train would probably stop the problems..... But if its a built-in asset you're changing, it may break it.... and if it does it could be re-install to get it back, (though you might be able to 'revert to original'). Depends how lucky you're feeling.

Mike

EDIT - Just seen another thread where the inv train issue is showing as 'missing'. I'm out this morning but I won't wait any longer. I will put next-kuid-up assets to obsolete the TS12 built-in ones on the DLS this evening

bisbeejim
June 15th, 2013, 01:22 AM
I noticed I cannot run 2010 on my computer. While my CPU appears to be fast enough, the trouble seems to be a slow graphics card. Could the problem your experiencing be a hardware problem?

Scottbe8
June 15th, 2013, 10:57 AM
Maybe this will help you: LINK (http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?102649-ATLS-ASSET-UPDATE-FOR-TS12-SP1-users)

boat
June 15th, 2013, 01:49 PM
I noticed I cannot run 2010 on my computer. While my CPU appears to be fast enough, the trouble seems to be a slow graphics card. Could the problem your experiencing be a hardware problem?

Hi, thanks for the thought but I think in this case there are a number of other factors involved.

The recent update of TS12 has involved updating several assets and N3V seem to have decided to increase the Kuid issue number with their updates. This is normally good practice since it indicates a change to an asset. Unfortunately I think their work on that coincided with me issuing a seperate update to some of my assets for other reasons. Consequently we have a situation of 2 'same issue number' assets, one on the DLS and the other built-in to TS 12 SP1. I think some thought might need to go into this for the future.

The other problem is that a particular script call on one of my assets does not work if the asset it refers to changes its issue number. This is unusual as normally an increase in issue number.... from say kuid:76656:1158 to kuid2:76656:1158:1, (the next issue up) will not cause a problem. Unfortunatley in this case it has. It looks like N3V have made a script modification to get around the problem but that has not worked in some cases. Hopefully my re-issues will get over the problem. We shall see.

I would also urge hotgrove to update to TS 2009 SP4 as the base TS 2009 CMP is a bit on the flakey side.

Cheers,

Boat

hotgrove
June 18th, 2013, 09:37 AM
I take on board what you are saying regarding service pack updates boat but i'm not going near any of them.......i'll just make do with the game as it is.....hearing far too many bad stories about them..........The ATLS system would be excellent for my tram routes if I could get it to work.....reluctantly I will have to give up on it.

boat
June 18th, 2013, 11:47 AM
OK Hotgrove. No problem.

The new assets are now on the DLS. If your version of CMP can't find them, you can always try a manual download of the cdp from the old TRS 2004 DLS. You will have to be logged on and registered for TS 2009.

Cheers,

Boat