Trainz vs MSTS-02-UNBIEST OPINION

[barbarotto]

this is only my opinion and your entitled to your and some advise for me as well that bieng said i think the quality of the northamerican steam and diesels are still better than trainz resone=msts is poor graphics in world compared to trainz 09 world builder but the locos which are still being designed and the new stuff 2009 engines and even some older stuff is still better than what i find on trainz 09 .....if your interested in world graphics 1st then trainz is supierior its after all 2009 compared to 2002msts but for me its all about the steam and diesels engines 1st and msts has the correct whistles graphics etc ....for example the default up bigboy of trainz 2009 has wrong whistle sound it does not sound like that in real life-msts big boys are more acuarate .....i have no vested interest in microsoft or auran so this is only an opinion......i bought 3rd party add ons and downloaded engines from a variety of places for trainz 09 and only 1 got it right all others were mediocre at best a 6/7 on a scale of 1-10........i wont mention names........if anyone knows of any excellent north usa locos let me know although i probably already hered about it and wasnt impressed but who knows? you see im kinda picky and want only the best available stuff or nothing at all

 

[norfolksouthern37]

oh
my
GOD
!111!1!!

 

[martinvk]

this is only my opinion and your ...

You didn't have to remove all the caps. In fact it is recommended that you leave the first letter of a new sentence in caps. Paragraphs are also good. :hehe:

There are no unbiased opinions but as long as the reader knows what the bias is, then the opinion can be properly evaluated. :wave: As for which is the better sim, that all depends on what you are measuring and what is important for you.

I like creating both objects and routes so the sim that lets me do that with the least amount fuss and bother gets my vote and it's for Trainz.

 

[sparky15]

Personally, I'm of the opinion none of the sims are necessarily "better" than the other. I have Trainz, MSTS and Railsimulator and like them each but for different reasons.

MSTS has the most realistic driving experience, in my opinion.
Railsimulator has some excellent graphics, but does need work.
Trainz is just a great general all around sim in it's own right.

Depending on what I'm in the mood for dictates which I'll use. A nice long run its MSTS, whip up a small route or do some switching between AI traffic its Trainz. Railsimulator fits somewhere between the two. To be honest if they could get the AI up to Auran's standards it would be my main sim, but could never replace the other two.

If you really enjoy rail sims you kind of owe it to yourself to try and maybe use more than one. MSTS was $10, RS was $10 and TRS2006 with TC1&2 ran me $15. Pretty cheap compared to the hours of fun I get from them.

Dave.......

 

[FirstSoloFlight]

My opinion is:

Stop playing games and go to school. :wave:

Reagrds,
FSF.

 

[martinvk]

My opinion is:

Stop playing games and go to school. :wave:

Reagrds,
FSF.

It may be your opinion but that is not an option in this thread. The OP asked about opinions on the different train sims.

As for school, been there done that.

 

[MountE]

I'd like to add my vote to Dave's. Have all three and use them all.

MSTS for the workorders (sessions) at North Eastern Railroad (NERR) great routes that stretch 200 to 300 miles and have 100's of sidings. Session that have lots of ai meets, goals and reports when you complete those goals.

Trainz is the easiest to build and run sessions.

Railworks needs alot of work but is beautiful.

MountE

 

[airtime]

My opinion is:

Stop playing games and go to school. :wave:

Reagrds,
FSF.

Unfortunatly they won't let me in, I'm too old, don't half miss the school meals...

As for rail simulator programs...

I liked MSTS when it first came out, due to the fact of the long distance American rail route Acela express.

I like Railsim/Railworks for it's long distance UK route Paddington to Oxford and very good locomotives and rolling stock, which look so realistic, as for route building, forget it, it's the most frustating, irrating and bloody awkwardness that cheeses me off, it's the hardest rail program to build a route in, let alone adding rolling stock.

Now as for trainz, totally the opposite, route building in this program is the easiest thing to do, no fiddling around for hours on end just to build a piece of track, want to add a locomotive - easy, how about rolling stock - easy, signals - easy, everything is easy to do and within an hour you could build a fantastic city with a goods yard, rolling stock the lot...

In my opinion, this is how I rate the simulators...

MSTS
Good points - long distance running on the Acela express line.
Bad points - Route building is trouble some and tire some.
Rate - 8 out of 10, for locomotive graphics and realism.

Railsim/Railworks
Good points - long distance running from Paddington to Oxford.
Bad points - Route building is frustating, awkward and time consuming.
Rate - 8 out 10, for realistic dopler effect train sounds including the horns/whistles.

Trainz
Good points - easy to use surveyor, build a super long route within an hour.
Bad Points - no realistic Dopler effect sounds, splines blend with everything.
Rate - 8 out of 10, for the continued help and friendly support of the trainz community and the determination from the Auran team to get trainz working right.

Out of all of the above, I believe if Trainz 2010 comes out fault free, the other simulation programs won't stand a chance, trainz will dominate and will be the best simulation on the market, because it's the easiest one to use.

Hope this helps

Joe Airtime

 

[sparky15]

TRS 2010 has me interested again after a long break. Been on an RS kick for a while learning route building. I also agree Auran could take over a large share of the train sim market but they need to work on some things before that happens.

ALL they need to do to knock off RS/RW is upgrade the graphics. For a lot of users of that program the graphics keeps them there.

MSTS has a large following who have been into it for years. For them its train handling and physics plus the graphics. A lot of those guys are ready for a new sim but won't give up what they have until something that can replicate train handling like MSTS comes along.

Trainz already has a great Surveyor and excellent AI abilities. Very desirable in a sim but until they improve the graphics and train handling physics I'll have a need for and enjoy all three for what they bring.

As far as route building I agree. MSTS's route and activity editors left me balled up in a corner. Its that hard to use. RS/RW though aren't that far off from Trainz. A few different quirks to learn but essentially the same.

Dave.....

 

[Vern]

Just curious about the OP's title header... If by MSTS02 he refers to the sequel, this never came to pass...twice. First time after Kuju threw in the towel, second earlier this year when MS canned most of their games division (Aces Studio) in a cost cutting exercise. So other than some very pretty renders and mock-ups, no one really knows what either proposed Version 2 would have offered.

As regards Failworks, certain elements are easier than MSTS(1) but overall Trainz has a huge edge with Surveyor when it comes to creating routes. I think most of us can forgive or at least tolerate the other operational deficiencies in exchange for this significant advantage.

Despite a route building extravaganza in MSTS from 2001 - 2005, when I last opened the Editor (having spent hours trying to coax this ancient programme and utilities to life under Vista) the experience was quite, quite horrible. I'm unlikely to go there again.

 

[Approach_Medium]

As far as realistic scenery, trains, etc, my vote goes to World of Subways.
I have the volume 1 NY Underground PATH. Not only are the graphics and train handling effects great, it gives me nice, smooth performance on an older system (P4 single core, 3.4Ghz, GeForce 9800 graphics card).

The bad thing about WOS is that you cannot add to or modify the routes. All you do is drive the trains.

I have MSTS, but do not have it installed at this point. Way back I recall slow frame rates and very jerky performance, but that was on a much older system. It should run OK on my current system.

I have RailSim, but not the latest version. I was going to upgrade, but the whole process of DL and install got me ticked off (Steam client, etc), so I gave up on it.
I do have to agree that RailSim/Railworks beats Trainz in the graphics department.
But I tried building a route in RailSim and gave up after an hour.

Now, with TS2010 coming soon, I have pre-ordered, and hopefully we will see some better graphics, and better overall performance.
I always get poor performance from TS2009 when the route gets highly populated with buildings & trees.

I bought the Treez pack, and am quite happy with it. You don't have the alpha channel problems that the old trees have.

One problem I have with any sim is that I expect it to perform so well that I cannot distinguish between it and real life. Now, I realize that this is not yet possible, especially on a system that is almost 5 years old.
I think in the end, we have to compromise. If we want the best train physics, we may not be able to have the best graphics, or visa versa.

Unfortunately, the program developers have a limited budget and limited time to build a product, so they must focus on a particular aspect(s) they want to accurately simulate.
Eventually, maybe in a couple to a few years down the road, we will see the perfect sim. Whether it comes from Auran, Microsoft, Steam, or another developer remains to be seen.

For now, I would say that if you want everything perfect, buy a short line railroad and play with real trains!

FW

 

[rjhowie]

I don't think it is possible to be un-bias about anything and that includes tran simulators.

My first discovery was Microsoft and was okay for a while then discovered Auran by sheer chance whilst surfing. Never looked back. Okay there may be some technical things about MS but for a non techy like me this was a Godsend. I can drive trains and trams and move from one to another - can programme them and so on. Sheer delight as well as a fun aspect and why not? Trainz gives me a broader enjoyment than just driving a train or whatever. The route I have built - a non-fictional whole city tramway and my new attempt at the railway system in Ulster would be something that I could not and would not want to attempt in MS.

Every so often this Trainz v the rest will understandably come up as some will not realise it has been repeated before but fair enough. I have kept MS only for one famous route (based on a a route I know well across the Irish Sea), So in essence the more technical minded will be able to give some argument on physics but for the run-of-the-mill average man like me who want to build without a step learning curve and have the relaxation and fun Trainz gives me is better than the medicine my doctor prescribes for my health!

 

[rwk]

What Trainz needs is more US routes, especially NS and CSX routes, Amtrak routes, and more North American large steam locomotives like Berkshires, Royal Hudson's, Northern's like 4-8-4 C&O #614, more models of US stations, Jim Weaver had a bunch (payware) but what happened to him? Bendorsey has some, too and gfisher as well. MSTS has more variety in US locomotives, coaches, freight cars, etc. but Trainz is getting there.

 

[marvel_01]

From what I read, what a contrary. Trainz being the easiest to build routes, has far less routes to drive than MSTS which is a pain to build routes for. Guess I have to pickup MSTS

 

[Red_Rattler]

From the original poster:

Last edited by Lost_Soul : November 6th, 2009 at 08:59 AM. Reason: Removal of caps in entire post

And I still can't understand the original poster's post. To the original poster, their seems to be an excess of full stops in the one place, instead of where full stops, capitals & other punctuation should be.

Back to topic. All simulators, be they train simulators or not have both their good and bad points. Some simulators are good at one task, but not another task, and vica-versa. And probably in all simulators, depending on how well an item is made, the item can look realistic or not realistic.

For example both the default versions of MSTS & earlier Trainz (without any added items) have/had track that was so unrealistic.

PS: I find it interesting that it always seems to be MSTS versus Trainz, not MSTS or Trainz versus other train simulators, but with some other new train simulators, such as RailSimulator, that may change.

 

[sparky15]

MSTS and Trainz have been around the longest. I think RS got a bum deal from their distributor who forced a North American and European separate releases. Once it went into the bargain bins a new company was formed to resurrect it and had to re-release it. Probably a lot of legal wrangling nobody saw and put the sim way behind as compared to the others. They're probably just to the point where they should have been two years ago.

Like has been said, all the sims have good and bad points, each doing some things better than the other. ALL of them have a learning curve to them and take some time to get used to. I find it funny how some of the MSTS guys find Surveyor a pain to use, I guess that using the MSTS Route Editor for so long its become second nature for them. Its what they are used to.

On another note, there is a new sim on the horizon called Open Rails I believe. It uses MSTS content natively. From the screen shots I've seen it looks pretty good so far. Still has a ways to go in development though.

For what its worth, I'm holding out for TRS2010 to see how that shakes out. After a run with route building in RS, its kind of hard to come back to Trainz. The ground textures and track, especially switches, in RS look excellent. Wish we could have something like those in Trainz.

Ah, variety, the spice of life.

Dave....

 

[jeffmorris]

I found out about "Open Rails" from other websites related to train simulators last night. It's in pre-beta stage.

 

[Red_Rattler]

Wouldn't Microsoft have some issues with another simulator that is compatible with MSTS?

 

[Ferngren]

MSTS-2 is far from dead, but for MS to re-hire the ACES staff again - not likely, so the sim would be released with a different name. Tricky question though, who's holding the rights to the game-engine and code, MS or ACES ?? (Cascade Game Foundry)

 

[Red_Rattler]

Ferngren, it's not MSTS-2 from what I can gather.

According to the other forum, I believe (at the moment) that it is a one man show, and somehow has the source codes or whatever they are called. My comment was that Microsoft may not like what they are doing.