Crossover signals

[sparky15]

Hi,
Thanks again for all your help so far. I have all my junctions from Andi06 up and running great. Now I'm moving into signaling. Pretty straight forward so far and working well except for one thing, crossovers.

I'm using NorfolkSouthern37's excellent searchlight signals and they look great. The only way to get a crossover to work is to use an 06 with a Dwarf between the two turnouts on the crossover track. If not I get the blinking green,yellow,red upper signal.

I did try an 08 Gantry signal with the same results. Also tried an 04 instead of an 06 or 08 and get the proper colored signal but have to rely on the Dwarf for the crossover track.

During testing I also find that depending on the locomotive direction I get a flashing yellow for the diverge, is this normal? All track is laid the same direction and I even laid the invisible track in the junction the same direction.

I have the Junction controller but have absolutely no idea what makes that thing tick.

So far I can live with what I have. Just curious if there is something I'm missing. It looks like I'll be able to control the AI with this set up. The small quirks I may just have to live with though.

Thanks again for all the help so far.

Dave....

 

[Approach_Medium]

Hi Dave;
Are you using the latest of the Norfolksouthern37 signals?
The Safetran type have extra dialog box to set up the junction direction so that the signals respond the way they should.
I am not sure about the other ones.
This addition is all about multiple junctions though, not crossovers. If you're dealing with just a simple set of crossovers, the searchlight signals should work fine without any further tweaking.

Remember that North American signals are not direction indicators; they indicate speed only.
For a crossover lined track 1 to track 2 you should get a more restricting light than that you will get when the switches are lined main to main.

As for the Junction Controller; it is designed to allow multiple junctions to be controlled together.
I use it all the time for crossovers, or other routes that are aligned together.
There is a tutorial that comes with the Junction Controller. They work perfectly in every situation.

If you need more specific help, let me know. I have been doing a lot of work with signalling, and have some complex interlockings.

Have a Happy!

FW

 

[Dermmy]

Sparky I had the same issue when signalling my Clovis sub, which has about 100 double crossovers. Most of the time most of the signals will show a clear aspect for straight through and a lower aspect for the diverging route. Mostly the signals are placed intuitively - RDs for a right diverge, LDs for a left diverge. But every now and then one crossover would either want an LD on a right diverge (or visa versa) and/or either sig would refuse to show a clear for the straight route.

Like you I found I could force the correct aspect by placing a signal (you use a dwarf, I used an invisible) in the centre of the crossover. The problem with this though is the chance that the un-needed 'centre' signal can bring a train to a stand totally fouling the c/over, so i did away with them.

My solution was to just place the sig that gave the highest aspect possible for the straight run but to make sure that no signal ever showed a highball green for the diverging route. None ever? Yes there are I think two places where no matter what I juggled there are highball greens through the crossover route.

IMHO Justin's signals are the best out there, ya just gotta live with the best you can get from them...

Andy

 

[norfolksouthern37]

Frank, i still have not released my 'smart' signals for 09+, you are the only one who has them so far.

without the smarter scripts in 09 or later, it is almost impossible to avoid the problems described here. it may have to do with track direction, or the way they were built, but i cannot find the real answer except that the signalling in previous versions is not smart enough.

Andy, you should see Clovis Sub with the new signals. i have even added intermediate signals on some areas, they work so much nicer and i can really have many trains moving at once without fear they will get stuck or go the wrong way.

 

[zwiga]

Frank, i still have not released my 'smart' signals for 09+, you are the only one who has them so far.

without the smarter scripts in 09 or later, it is almost impossible to avoid the problems described here. it may have to do with track direction, or the way they were built, but i cannot find the real answer except that the signalling in previous versions is not smart enough.

Is there any kind of timetable or dateline for the release of those ?

I'm sure we are thousand waiting for them.

 

[Dermmy]

Andy, you should see Clovis Sub with the new signals. i have even added intermediate signals on some areas, they work so much nicer and i can really have many trains moving at once without fear they will get stuck or go the wrong way.

I saw you posts at Trainzdev (I think) with the new 08s and 05s described and thought I could see an 09-specific version of Clovis3 in my future...

Andy

 

[sparky15]

Once again, thanks for all the help.

Basically I'm just using the signals to prevent the old cornfield uh ohs. The route I'm building is basically a model railroad type layout, just to get a better hang of the capabilities of Trainz. This is my first "real" route and having a blast, all my others were just, well, leave it at that.

Andy, I see what you mean about tricking the signals. Also tried swapping LD and RD around. I tried the invisible signal but didn't like the invisible part. I've adjusted a lot of the track work so basically the driver would be the only one to see it. It would never affect the AI routing other than stopping it if I foul it's path. May not be prototypical but I think I can deal with checking for a Dwarf after getting an initial signal from the 06. May just go to the 04s in some situations and have to pay better attention to my path.

FW, no matter what I do, a simple passing track with a siding coming off of it freaks the whole works out. Without an invisible or Dwarf somewhere I either get the red, yellow, green flashing or only the top signal working on the 06. Same with an 08 gantry. Thats how I got the idea of just using an 04. Maybe not the best solution but it would stop an AI train, which would never use the siding anyway. I'm a fan of single track mains and the 06s work great for just passing tracks.

And finally NS37. The signals you already put out are great as they are. Excellent job with them and if you improved them thats saying something. You can see its the game logic plugging up the works. If you do release the new set I may upgrade to 2009 just to use them. Thanks for what you've put out so far, I for one appreciate them.

Oh well, back to the grindstone to see what else I can mess up. Thanks again for all the help.

Dave.......

 

[Dermmy]

...I either get the red, yellow, green flashing...
Dave.......

Maybe I misunderstand, but red-yellow-green flashing in rotation only appears in Surveyor. You CANNOT check signals properly in Surveyor, you must load the route in Driver. The red/yellow/green sequential flash in surveyor indicates that there is no absolute clear route ahead, but the signal will almost always give an acceptable Caution or Stop aspect in Driver.

Appologies if I misunderstand - Justin's signals can also show flashing aspects in Driver, but in that case the flashing signal is prototypicaly correct...

Andy

 

[Approach_Medium]

Frank, i still have not released my 'smart' signals for 09+, you are the only one who has them so far.

without the smarter scripts in 09 or later, it is almost impossible to avoid the problems described here. it may have to do with track direction, or the way they were built, but i cannot find the real answer except that the signalling in previous versions is not smart enough.

Andy, you should see Clovis Sub with the new signals. i have even added intermediate signals on some areas, they work so much nicer and i can really have many trains moving at once without fear they will get stuck or go the wrong way.

Woops! My bad. I was getting you confused with BNSF50's Grade Xings. I did some beta testing on his crossings, and then he did release the new versions.

Have a Happy!

FW

 

[Approach_Medium]

If I ever learn TrainzScript well enough, I'm going to create a Signal Controller that will help get things straight. I got this idea from the Junction Controller by mizi. I'm hoping I can glean some hints from his script file.

I'm still pretty far away from that though. I have decided that before I even think of mastering TrainzScript, I need to master C++, so I am studying that now.

There is a "control multiple signals" rule, but it uses triggers, which don't work too well for signals, unless you can place an entering and leaving trigger for each direction, like the ATLS system. I wonder whether ATLS could be adapted to work for signals?

FW

 

[sparky15]

Thanks Andy,
I haven't tried to check everything out in driver yet. Usually by placing a locomotive and moving it around in Surveyor gets the signals to change aspects. I have only tried the basics out in Driver. I have a small test route set up and I'll try everything out this evening. Like I said, just starting to delve deeper into the game. Plus being two IQ points above being put in a pot and watered twice a week doesn't help either.

I was able to do some basic signaling and check it out in Surveyor and it also worked in Driver. Knowing me I'm just missing a step somewhere. I'll give it another go tonight. Got a small ice storm going on and everything is a skating rink outside so need something to do.

Thanks again for the help.

Dave............

 

[sparky15]

Thanks for all the previous help. Finally got my noodle wrapped around the signaling.

One thing is stumping me though, mounting an 06 or 08 gantry signal. Seems they mount to the appropriate gantry "low"". Instead of projecting up, mounted by the lower head, they hang down under the gantry. Got to be something simple but how do you mount them properly?

Thanks again for all the help.

Dave......

 

[sparky15]

Disregard!

I went ahead and downloaded the Safetran CL_V1 signals from JointedRail. I thought their Searchlight and NS style signals were good but these are better. Many thanks to NS37 for these.

Thanks again,
Dave.......