Check Consist Rule - Humpyard

[Crumpet49]

Hi,

Im attempting to build a hump yard, where the stock is sorted automatically.

To automate the process I want to have some sort of rule/trigger combination where the load or priority of the stock is identified, and the junctions set appropriately.

Ideally I want the function of the "check consist" rule, but tied down to a trackmark or trigger.

Basically I was hoping someone might be able to offer any suggestions, or any help in creating such a rule if one does not already exist somewhere!

Thanks in advance!

 

[JCitron]

Look on the DLS for a hump kit, or somethng like that. There's a U-Make map that features one, but I can't recall the name offhand.

Look for UM, and U Make. This might help with the search.

Even if you don't want the route, download it anyway to get the pieces to make the hump yard.

John

 

[Crumpet49]

Thanks, I have the hump yard kit, it is excellent, however it is limited in that sorting the cars is either set to random, or to be done completely manually.

What I am trying to do is set a trigger point that identifies the cars load, and then sets a route through the yard.
I would then have a copy of the rule for each type of load, with a child rule that sets the route.

 

[JCitron]

Thanks, I have the hump yard kit, it is excellent, however it is limited in that sorting the cars is either set to random, or to be done completely manually.

What I am trying to do is set a trigger point that identifies the cars load, and then sets a route through the yard.
I would then have a copy of the rule for each type of load, with a child rule that sets the route.

That's too complicated, I think. Perhaps one of the trigger experts can help you.

Sorry about that.

John

 

[Crumpet49]

Oh right, I suppose it seemed easier than it is! Im not really looking for something new, just a combination of 2 existing rules. I have included a screen shot to show what I mean:

Rules:

>Uncouple at trackmark - (at trackmark "uncouple")
>Check Consist at Trackmark - (at trackmark "check consist") "wait for consist priority 1
>> Set junction etc etc.
>Check Consist at Trackmark - (at trackmark "check consist") "wait for consist priority 2
>> Set junction etc etc.
>Check Consist at Trackmark - (at trackmark "check consist") "wait for consist priority 3
>> Set junction etc etc.

Thats probably as simple as I can make it. Idealy I wanted to check for a certain load rather than priority, but if I use the set priority driver command after loading, then that replicates this system.

If any trigger experts could offer any advise on this that would be great! Thanks though John!

 

[Kennilworth]

Hi

My area of interest is programming automated routes using the SCS2006 rule from TPR. If I was attempting to program something like this for the example above I would be looking at giving each wagon a variable containing a random integer between 1 and 4. The consist would need to contain the same number of wagons each time (10 for example) and I would set up a loop activated by the trigger which would look at the integer value of each wagon in turn and set the path accordingly.

It sounds fairly straight forward but experience tells me that there will be a lot of problems to overcome to get this working. The wife has me decorating at the moment but when I get time I'll have a look at programming this to see if it's feasable.

Regards

Brian

 

[Crumpet49]

Hi,

Thanks, yeah I had thought about SCS2006, I have it downloaded, but I haven't yet had the time to sit down and get my head round it!

My overall aim is to build the whole yard process, with arrival and departure yards, and then portals to represent the industries off the mainline. A huge project... for me anyway!

 

[Kennilworth]

Hi again

Yes SCS2006 takes a lot of getting to grips with but I have found it is excellent for programming things that are difficult or impossible with driver commands.

With regard to the yard that you mention, I am currently developing a coalmine yard which has 7 tracks, 3 reception tracks, 3 departure tracks and one for the locos to run round their trains. A loco bringing in a consist of empties checks for an empty reception siding to leave them in. It then uncouples from them and runs back down the yard to the other end where it then checks the departure sidings looking for a consist of loaded wagons to couple up to. These are then taken to the power station.

The shunter waits for the coalmine queue to get big enough to load the complete train before checking the reception sidings looking for a consist of empties. It couples to the empties and loads them and then checks the departure sidings looking for an empty one where it leaves the loaded wagons. There are 3 locos, 5 consists of hopper wagons and the shunter. I use a lot of variables to keep track of where each loco or consist is and which sidings are occupied.

A lot of this would be adaptable to what you are trying to achieve.

Sorry that this a bit long winded but it should give you some idea of what can be achieved with SCS2006.

Regards

Brian

 

[Crumpet49]

Yeh it looks like SCS2006 is going to be the way to go with this then. Your yard sounds very impressive, that sort of monitoring process is what I am trying to achieve. I think Il create a basic yard just to experiment and see what I can do. Thanks for your help!

 

[Dap]

Cars are never sorted by content, they are sorted by destination. You could have a string of 25 open hoppers loaded with coal and each car could have a different destination, thus needing to be put on different tracks in a classification yard. You might consider a destination system such as CMTM. With this system, every car has a series of destination, just like on the railroads we are trying to simulate. I'm sure that someone could write a module that would throw the switches in a hump yard based on the destination of the cars. And of course, the recieving tracks in a hump yard are assigned dynamically throughout the day, depending on the vareity of the incoming traffic. Acurately simulating the operations of a hump yard is a very complex endeavor.

You might consider using CMTM and manually throw the switches, just to get a feel for hump yard operations.

I have looked at SCS2006 and found it to be very confining. IMHO, it turns your railroad into a robot that does not know how to interact to anything other than its given task.

 

[tankbob]

hope you get the mine working

Hi again

Yes SCS2006 takes a lot of getting to grips with but I have found it is excellent for programming things that are difficult or impossible with driver commands.

With regard to the yard that you mention, I am currently developing a coalmine yard which has 7 tracks, 3 reception tracks, 3 departure tracks and one for the locos to run round their trains. A loco bringing in a consist of empties checks for an empty reception siding to leave them in. It then uncouples from them and runs back down the yard to the other end where it then checks the departure sidings looking for a consist of loaded wagons to couple up to. These are then taken to the power station.

The shunter waits for the coalmine queue to get big enough to load the complete train before checking the reception sidings looking for a consist of empties. It couples to the empties and loads them and then checks the departure sidings looking for an empty one where it leaves the loaded wagons. There are 3 locos, 5 consists of hopper wagons and the shunter. I use a lot of variables to keep track of where each loco or consist is and which sidings are occupied.

A lot of this would be adaptable to what you are trying to achieve.

Sorry that this a bit long winded but it should give you some idea of what can be achieved with SCS2006.

Regards

Brian

hiya kennilworth


Just to wish you luck with your mine project and if and when you get it done will you releasing it to the dls as i could really use something like that on my route and i dont have the skill to program it myself.


cheers bob

 

[misquetofarmer]

Humptower...Yardtower

I too downloaded the Hump kit...I am using 2010. of coarse I had some issues. One thing stumped me though the documentation made reference to destination tables.. I am not sure what a destination table is It wasn't available to play with in the humpyard kit I downloaded. from what the documentation referred to I could see that it was possible to assign your Hump tracks to particular destinations and commodities. I am still experimenting with it. I was thinking that the destination table may be something not available to me in 2010 version.

However if there is a way to USE a destination table in combination with the Hump yard kit it might solve your problem or at least give your automation plan another opportunity.

 

[Kennilworth]

Hi Bob

At the moment this is just a very basic layout to test the ideas and techniques out. The layout is 3 baseboards long with just the yard and coalmine at one end and a return loop with a 3 track storage yard to represent the power station at the other. Once I have it running automatically for a few hours I may look at incorporating it into a larger layout but my routes tend to be just track laid on a baseboard as route building doesn't particularly interest me.

In the meantime I would be quite happy to share my ideas and methods with anyone who is interested in this.

Regards

Brian

 

[tankbob]

hiya brian

i would take it as it was if you get it working and do the rest myself and of course if released you would get all the credit for the mine n power station section.


cheers bob

 

[trev999]

Hi Crumpet49 - I am not familiar with "Check consist at trackmark" but have another idea. It is possible to assign running numbers to vehicles.

The destination table might be something unique to the Hump kit, (not familiar with that either) but it sounds to me like they might make use of the Worktable rule, which allows free-form data tables to be created. They are used with driver commands like "Velocity Controlled Drive to Trackmark" for setting up speed tables.

Now one could set up a "Running number range" table with format:

Rn, t,x,mmmm,nnnn

where Rn is the rule identifier, t the trackside mark, x the range number and mmmm & nnnn the starting and ending running numbers of that range, then all that would be needed is a rule "Check Worktable" (which needs to be written) which can execute a set of child "SwitchJunction" rules when the running number of the vehicle falls within the specified range.

If this method of sorting vehicles is in line with what you want, I will look into producing a rule that does the job, but don't hold your breath!

I have only TRS2004 currently so much of the new stuff on DLS won't load on my machine. Also, I am on dial-up ISP so I don't hang around on the forum.

Cheers - Trevor

 

[Kennilworth]

Hi

I've built a very basic humpyard to try out some ideas but the early signs are that it won't work with SCS2006. Each time I uncouple a boxcar from a moving consist it generates an error code and freezes the thread. I don't know if this is just a problem with SCS2006 running in TS2010 but if I can dig out my old copy of TRS2006 I'll install it and try it in that.

Regards

Brian

 

[trev999]

Hi All - I tried making a very small hump on a straight track breaking out into several lines by raising the vertex of a spline point just before a trackmark.

Set up a loco with three cars ahead of it facing the hump.

Then I issued a "Drive to trackmark" command followed by a "Split consist" command. The loco droveto the trackmark, stopped and uncoupled the frontmost car but then did not roll down the slope.

I clicked on the car and pressed the keyboard button to release the handbrake and the car rolled away and derailed at a buffer even though the height of the vertex was only about 0.3 metres above ground level.

How is the speed of the car controlled in a hump yard?
Does the uncoupling need to take place while the loco is moving?
If I click on th car and apply the brake, it stops dead, but I heard a squeeking sound like the brakeman turning the brake wheel, that went on and on.

If this operation is to be automated, would you prefer to use Rules (behaviors) or Driver Commands or a combination of both?

I think that using running numbers is the key to the solution; a trigger rule that reacts to the RN and sets the path, but what about the above problems?

Cheers

Trevor

 

[Crumpet49]

Hi,

Yes, a system that check the running numbers would be ideal, but as far as I can tell there is no such rule.

To control the speed of the wagons in the yard, you need to use the humpyard kit, available at:http://www.trainzproroutes.com/downloads/

To uncouple the wagons, place a track mark at the peak, and using the uncouple at trackmark rule KUID : 61392:1076

The shunt the wagons towards the hump, and as they reach the trackmark, they will be uncoupled and roll down towards the retarders based on the route set either by the humpyard kit, or you manually.

I found that by using only the retarders from the kit, and a system of rules based on consist names, I could control the route automatically for each wagon. However this takes a long time to set up, and is very inefficient!

 

[Dap]

If someone will write a rule, or at the very least, define a rule that will inquire the destination of a car at the trackmark and then throw the appropriate switches, I'd be more than happy to write the interface to CMTM to provide the destination information to thhat rule. You could also code the track as a destination for the car into the CMTM database, that way you will not need a look-up table to determine on which track a car bound for Waxahatche would be placed.

 

[socalwb909]

-u can try this! don't know if this helps but hey i tried!
http://www.gaurc.us/?p=245
-Joe