Changed horses in mid-stream

[HiBaller]

I really messed up this time. Short story:

I have three computers on a KVM switch. One of them has 2004 and UTC. One of them has 2006 and 2009. The last one has 2010.

I can see you're way ahead of me. Yes, I did forget which computer I was on and installed the offsite backup CDP from one of my 2009 routes I was working on into my 2010. Not noticing the error I continued to work on it (in 2010) adding several boards and generally making quite a bit of progress. The GUIs are generally the same, and I tend to charge ahead and use mostly the Object & Texture slide-outs. Missed the fact I had the layers tab also.

The next morning, I opened 2009 properly and started up Surveyor on my - supposedly - updated route. What the heck? Nothing I'd done was present. Fast-forward to the next computer and there, in 2010, were my changes.

Much gnashing of teeth ensued.

I have now spent about an hour doing various searches throughout the forum, using hundreds of different combination's of search terms, and have come up with none of the threads I know I've seen on "how to go backwards from 2010 to 2009 - and, is it possible?"

That's my question.

I've tried several things, but every time I try, 2009 starts up and lets me select the route but when it starts to load the entire Trainz program vanishes from the screen & Task manager like it was never present. No Event Viewer errors and nothing in jetlog.txt.

Bill

 

[jadebullet]

You can't, as far as I tell. Heck, we are having trouble backdating from SP3 to SP2 when it comes to 2010 routes.

 

[HiBaller]

That's pretty much my conclusion too. All the file structures are the same as near as I can tell, but for some reason it just won't work. Life was a lot simpler with 2004. I wrote a lot of programs for it that did all sorts of things. 2010 is a really complex program with a file structure to match.

Bill

 

[VinnyBarb]

One of the things I would try, namely exporting the new boards as a CDP route and after installing these in your TS09 program, opening these for editing. Yes, I know, these would have a different version number but one can edit that to the earlier version number. As long as you did not use any of the newfangled layers on the new boards, my guess is, you might be able to add these boards on to your 09 board.

At least it is worth a try, isn't it? Let us know how you go with it to see if this works and good luck with it :wave:.

Cheers

VinnyBarb

 

[HiBaller]

Hmmm. That sounds as if it might work. Before I do that, I may try and do a merge of all the layers into one layer. Then I'll chop out the new boards I've added and make a CDP of that Route and not the Session.

I have a feeling that it's the layers that are stopping the 'downgrade' process cold.

Bill

 

[HiBaller]

Well, poop. That didn't work either. I chopped off everything except the new boards I'd added, did an Edit in Explorer and saved off a copy of the directory. Then I fired up 2009 and retrieved it from the shared directory and did an "Import as Content". Imported fine, showed no errors, no missing content, but did exactly the same thing as before - completely wiped all traces of Trainz from the desktop when it started loading.

Looks like I'm just out of luck unless I can convince the guys I'm building this for to buy 2010 -OR- drop back several revisions and do the work over again. I really don't want to re-create a two-board "join" with a 2-spiral tunnel under a mountain to disguise the jump/drop in elevations.

Bill

 

[narrowgauge]

Bill

I think you are stuck, even thought you have merged all the layers, the file structure to handle them still exists and I guess that is what is causing your problem. The map file conversion only works one way - into TS2010.

Peter

 

[HiBaller]

I guess so, Peter. That's what happens when you have five separate versions of basically the same game. What butters my buns is that every version has a slightly different directory/file structure which makes altering anything extremely difficult.

I can't believe I worked on this for an entire week and didn't tumble that I was using the wrong version on it. Ratz!

Bill

 

[stagecoach]

I think if you search for 2009 SP4 (which is not available as yet) you will find that update, if finished would allow back tracking 10 to 09, otherwise not at present.

 

[clam1952]

Having tried to revert the route I'm working on to 2009, mainly as a few who have not got 2010 wanted to know if it would work in 2009, I think I've tried every trick in the book, it won't work, due to some differences in the format of the files which makes it incompatible, as well as the layers there is an extra file, presumably containing some element that was originally part of one of the other files in 2009.
The only thing that you can revert to 2009 to 2010 is the mapfile.gnd which I did manage to get into the early version in 2009 by just copying it over the old one.

That should at least save you having to add the extra boards and redo the terrain? I would back up the original mapfile.gnd first though in case it doesn't work in your case.

 

[HiBaller]

I gave that a try a while ago, Malc. It didn't work for me. My main concern is having to re-create a serpentine, figure eight shaped tunnel that drops 72M in two boards. I hid it inside a mountain. The GND file just gets me the mountain and not any content or splines which are in the TRK file. A run at 60Kph through the tunnel takes 6 minutes.

I've done some digging into the file formats also and found that you are likely to be correct. Data structures that formerly lived in the TRK file are now only partially there. Portions of them are now in the LYR file - the layer file. The whacking up of the 2009 formats into what exists in 2010 was probably aimed at cutting out any chance of third-party persons writing any software to mess with the new formats. Speaking as a programmer of many years, the thought of creating a program that addresses (at the very least) five different file formats for the same game is simply nutz.

Bill