Can Pantograph be raised in Surveyor?

obo

New member
I use Surveyor to take screenshots as the camera controls are better than those available in Driver. However, this means that all the electrics have their pantographs down. Can they be raised in Surveyor?

Thanks,

Rob.
 
Hi Rob,
No the pantographs can't be raised in Surveyor.
Only in Driver can they be raised by hitting the little button in the Driver HUD or by KP1 (KP=Key Pad).
 
Thanks Titaniclover. I was afraid of that but I was hoping I'd overlooked something.

Rob.
 
Hello everybody,

Is there a tram or trainmodel available where the pantograph has been designed in the upwards position. A model which is only used when one is making his/her route and is busy with the placement of pylons, catenary, etc.

I have been looking on the DLS, but didn't find a train or tram model.

I downloaded the catenary height tool and the UK catenary height tool, but just wondered if anyone designed a train/tram model with the pantograph up .

Best regards

Kurt :wave:
 
@ obo - As you don't have your location on your details, I'm not sure if I can help but I'm guessing the reason you ask this question is in relation to setting up catenary? I got a kindly content creator to make me a catenary height tool but it's only good for UK assets. There may be something similar for higher panto heights. Search the DLS for pantograph height tools. I'm sure I found a few but none were for the UK so that makes me think there is a US or EU version available already. Sorry if I have misunderstood your reason for asking.
 
@ obo - As you don't have your location on your details, I'm not sure if I can help but I'm guessing the reason you ask this question is in relation to setting up catenary? I got a kindly content creator to make me a catenary height tool but it's only good for UK assets. There may be something similar for higher panto heights. Search the DLS for pantograph height tools. I'm sure I found a few but none were for the UK so that makes me think there is a US or EU version available already. Sorry if I have misunderstood your reason for asking.

Hello Pfx,

Obo originally started this thread in 2007. I just took this thread because it was more or less relavant to my question ( see post #4 ).

Best regards

Kurt :wave:
 
No problem. I didn't even look at the dates! I just wasn't paying attention. Eejit that I am. Gabh mo leithscéal.
 
Hello everybody,

Is there a tram or trainmodel available where the pantograph has been designed in the upwards position. A model which is only used when one is making his/her route and is busy with the placement of pylons, catenary, etc.
Kurt :wave:

There are 2 trams made by "motorman1066" as scenic items with raised trolley poles, 6.4 metre height. They are trs2004 models so tick the 2004 box if you use the black DLS search.


Doug.
 
There are 2 trams made by "motorman1066" as scenic items with raised trolley poles, 6.4 metre height. They are trs2004 models so tick the 2004 box if you use the black DLS search.


Doug.

Hello Doug.

Thank you for your reply and information.

I did a search via " the black DLS http://www.auran.com/TRS2004/DLS.php ", but unfortunately no more items of 2004 were available. I tried the same from within the content manager - no luck - same result.

I downloaded the models Dropcentre tramcar 365 and Brisbane four motor tramcar 480, but trolley was down.

Do you have the models of 2004?

Thank you.

Best regards

Kurt :wave:
 
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A Way to Do It

Hello Peter,

Thank you for your assistance :).

Downloaded both - but trolley is also down.

Best regards

Kurt :wave:

This may be overcomplicated/impractical, but if you're hanging a lot of wire on a layout with serious hills/curvature might be worth a try:

Clone the loco/tram you're actually going to use on the layout.

Add an attachment point (or points) identical in location to the existing a.pant0 (and a.pant1) with different name(s).

Assign the loco's panto asset to those attachment points, too, in config.

In the loco's script, order the (extra) panto's animation(s) to run to the last frame (usually 29). This will cause it to execute when placed in Surveyor and place the panto(s) in full-up position.

Result: a loco with the pantos shown in both positions (double exposure) in Surveyor.

To see script/config which does something like this, see <KUID: 520526:1616> which sets the pantos to a desired height set by user. The "magic words" are where it sets the height to a calculated animation frame - just use 29.
 
Hi again Kurt
Well, that is a surprise to me, I seem the remember the trams as having the poles up. It has been a quite a while since I have used 2004. I am sorry I got your hopes up, I will go through my back up files tomorrow and see if i do have such a thing.

Doug.
 
This may be overcomplicated/impractical, but if you're hanging a lot of wire on a layout with serious hills/curvature might be worth a try:

Clone the loco/tram you're actually going to use on the layout.

Add an attachment point (or points) identical in location to the existing a.pant0 (and a.pant1) with different name(s).

Assign the loco's panto asset to those attachment points, too, in config.

In the loco's script, order the (extra) panto's animation(s) to run to the last frame (usually 29). This will cause it to execute when placed in Surveyor and place the panto(s) in full-up position.

Result: a loco with the pantos shown in both positions (double exposure) in Surveyor.

To see script/config which does something like this, see <KUID: 520526:1616> which sets the pantos to a desired height set by user. The "magic words" are where it sets the height to a calculated animation frame - just use 29.

Hello PWeiser,

Thank you for your information.

Could you advice me where I can find some information ( tutorials ) about your given method? This info is new for me, and I have no knowledge of config/scripting.

My route is a combination of tram and train and at this time, I have a problem finding the right catenary in combination with the tram and train models I going to use. The pantograph is either just below or just above - it all depends on the placement of the pylons in combination with the height of the underground ( no hills by the way ). Of the 15 electrical Belgian locomotives, I would like to use, only 3 are useable in combination with the pylon ( catenary ) that I found.

I would be great if there was a method where the pantograph matches exactly the catenary without one having to consider the placement of the pylon.

Best regards

Kurt :wave:
 
Hi again Kurt
Well, that is a surprise to me, I seem the remember the trams as having the poles up. It has been a quite a while since I have used 2004. I am sorry I got your hopes up, I will go through my back up files tomorrow and see if i do have such a thing.

Doug.

Hello Doug,

Perhaps the original tram models with poles up are no longer available. Your effort, going through your backup files is very much appreciated :Y:

Here is a screenshot of the situation

belgian46_20120614_0000.jpg



Best regards

Kurt :wave:
 
Pantos and Trolley Poles in Trainz

@belgian46: The two problems with all overhead power pickups in Trainz are that there is no programmatic interaction, and no standards. In an ideal world the contact wire would (programmatically) be visible to the traincar just as the track is, and contact wheels/shoes/wipers could follow it. Or Trainz could demand that all contact wires be at (for example) 6.5m above the track, and content creators would be responsible for making their pickup devices reach exactly that level.

Since none of this is the case, catenary creators set the wire where they like, creators of pantograph assets build them so they rise to a fixed height above the traincar (based on a frequently wrong assumption about where the wire will be) and traincar creators set the pantograph base height to match the roof of the car, frequently frustrating both catenary and pantograph creators.

Returning to the Belgian tram situation, you've found that only three models - that is, combinations of main asset and a particular panto asset - come close to the wire height of your desired pylons. Best practice, as I understand it, is to use a catenary height gauge object in Surveyor and adjust the height of the chosen pylon set objects so the wire height matches the pole/panto contact height of your chosen traincars.

The advantage of having a pole/panto "up" model in Surveyor is that you could move it along the track, adjusting not only height but centering of the wire to where the shoe or contact wheel goes on that particular traincar in curves. The height gauge won't do that for you.

My own contribution has been a (not very successful) auto-centering trolley pole system in which the trolley wheel follows the center of the track, and a system which allows users to set the "up" height of specially-constructed pantos and trolley poles to match a desired contact wire height (that is, a particular pylon asset). While I have hopes it will catch on, it has to be set up for each pantograph asset and locomotive with specific knowledge of dimensions, etc.. So far ony three locomotive assets use it (that I know of).

So unfortunately there's no way to generalize those instructions on making a panto-up clone for Surveyor (in my post above) if you're not comfortable altering configurations and scripts. Your best bet is to use a height guage, first to determine the "up" height for your traincars (in Driver) and then to set the wire height (in Surveyor).
 
@belgian46: The two problems with all overhead power pickups in Trainz are that there is no programmatic interaction, and no standards. In an ideal world the contact wire would (programmatically) be visible to the traincar just as the track is, and contact wheels/shoes/wipers could follow it. Or Trainz could demand that all contact wires be at (for example) 6.5m above the track, and content creators would be responsible for making their pickup devices reach exactly that level.

Since none of this is the case, catenary creators set the wire where they like, creators of pantograph assets build them so they rise to a fixed height above the traincar (based on a frequently wrong assumption about where the wire will be) and traincar creators set the pantograph base height to match the roof of the car, frequently frustrating both catenary and pantograph creators.

Returning to the Belgian tram situation, you've found that only three models - that is, combinations of main asset and a particular panto asset - come close to the wire height of your desired pylons. Best practice, as I understand it, is to use a catenary height gauge object in Surveyor and adjust the height of the chosen pylon set objects so the wire height matches the pole/panto contact height of your chosen traincars.

The advantage of having a pole/panto "up" model in Surveyor is that you could move it along the track, adjusting not only height but centering of the wire to where the shoe or contact wheel goes on that particular traincar in curves. The height gauge won't do that for you.

My own contribution has been a (not very successful) auto-centering trolley pole system in which the trolley wheel follows the center of the track, and a system which allows users to set the "up" height of specially-constructed pantos and trolley poles to match a desired contact wire height (that is, a particular pylon asset). While I have hopes it will catch on, it has to be set up for each pantograph asset and locomotive with specific knowledge of dimensions, etc.. So far ony three locomotive assets use it (that I know of).

So unfortunately there's no way to generalize those instructions on making a panto-up clone for Surveyor (in my post above) if you're not comfortable altering configurations and scripts. Your best bet is to use a height guage, first to determine the "up" height for your traincars (in Driver) and then to set the wire height (in Surveyor).

Hello PWeiser,

Thank you for the extra information and advice.

I did some tests yesterday on flat terrain, using several train locomotives and trams. The problem is that my route is not flat and I will have to look at the specific situation when I arrive at the specific point. Placement of pylons, catenary in combination with the selected tram and trains is not that easy and takes a lot of time.

And I still have to learn so much - making own objects ( trainstation ) to include in my route. In the beginning of the year, I placed in my to do book - start with Gmax. Nearly 6 months later - Gmax is installed, that's it. Making drawings is not one of my skills - so presently I don't know weather to start with Gmax or trying some test with Google sketchup and digital photographs. It all takes a lot of time.

I can only go along step by step.


Best regards

Kurt
:wave:
 
Hello Doug,

Perhaps the original tram models with poles up are no longer available. Your effort, going through your backup files is very much appreciated :Y:

Best regards

Kurt :wave:

Hi again Kurt.

I have checked and I am sorry to say all the scenery tram files have their poles down in surveyor.

Doug.
 
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Hi again Kurt.

I have checked and I am sorry to say all the scenery tram files have their poles down in surveyor.

Doug.

Hello Doug,

Thank you for doing the research and verification :):cool: . I will see if there is another helpfull option available.

Best regards

Kurt :wave:
 
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