Borders Railway re-opening a big success - possible extension in future?

[rjhowie]

Well following the official re-opening by HM The Queen it has met all hopes with usage and trains will have extra coaches put on the trains. As has already been said it is the longest re-opening in Gt Britain at over 30 miles and great news all round. What has also been of passing interest is that the old story of whether it would be perhaps in the future considered for extensions and perhaps on the original way across the Borders and over the Border to Carlisle.

Obviously that is not top of the agenda at present but one Scots government minister has said that he thinks it would be very worth looking at in due course. When this was mooted it was known that there was to be nothing beyond the present destination just beyond Galashiels to Tweedbank. The thoughts included the lie of the land and that there were spots where the trackbed area had been sold off and there would be a lack of speed issues, etc. Then the added cost due to the geography but the part opened was within time and the cost estimated. The continuing success of the Borders main line is a big boost to the region and I am quietly optimistic for the rest of the route over a time period.

Interestingly too another area has been raised and that is in North East Scotland and the long gone line to the Buchan area to Fraserburgh and the branch off it to Peterhead. It had died for a while but the Borders gain is resurrecting that idea. Now i must organise a train run tfrom Glasgow to Edinburgh and a trip down the Borders Line. Who knows, maybe one day people in hawick and the other Borders towns may hear a train again?!

 

[amigacooke]

Perhaps the remainder of the line could be HS17

Glad to hear it's a success, more power to the Scots!

 

[JCitron]

That's great news. I'm glad the numbers of riders exceeded the expectations. Let's hope they do consider reopening the line back down to Carlisle. Like many lines we know of, why did they close this one in the first place!

John

 

[rjhowie]

I think John it was because of a very long campaign that stretched decades! The lady who was the "leader" was given special treatment just before the offical opening by Her Majesty and a goodly age now. There were odd negatives a long, long time ago on it's original building diagonally across from Edinburgh to Carlisle as not a possible fnancial benefit. And inmore modern times when the campaign started doubts about bringing it back on financial grounds. The branchlines off it were closed first then on the last day of the main Borders line the campaigners as I said a time ago blocked the line. A local Church of Scotland minister joined the blocking protestors and the police eventually went to get the local MP to see if he could clear them away and that eventually happened. What I found obnoxious when the railways were in the hands of the State under BR was that when a preservation society potential wanted to take it over it was refused?? Head shaking that one!

People i the towns beyond the present line end have been making some views on getting the extension to them right down to the old junction with the main line into Carlisle. The elderly ladysaid they should do what she and her associates did and fight. Critics would murmur about the financial risks, etc but that has already been dispensed with by the present success. There would probably be some extra coasting due to the geography and getting back small parts of the old trackbed that were sold off when closed. It is not a mountainous place in the Borders it is a lovely background of rolling braes (slopes to the un-initiated!) and cost effecting and there would not be a high speed train aspect but it is still part of the Borders like the existing 30 odd miles brought back and i think it would be great. That one government mind in Edinburgh thinks it is worth looking at is something politically BUT there must be a new organisation of started for the line beyond the end point.

When the long closed line to Larkhall was brought back and part of the Greater Glasgow electric area and the branch from Stirling to Alloa they were proved successful. And years ago when the Argyle (Street) line in Glasgow was brought back and re-joined the network it was proved to be a success along with the new stations.

So it is now up to the Borderers south of Tweedale in one of the major places, maybe like Hawick to form a group and take on the mantle that those north of that end won!

 

[JCitron]

I have a feeling that the momentum will get going and group will form to reopen the rest of the line as long as there is political support behind it because once the political wealth builds up out of this, the finances follow. The elderly woman is too old to fight now, but sure could be tapped for information. She's right get out and start fighting for the line.

We've had the same over here in New England. Pan Am Railways closed the former Maine Central Mountain Division and the old B&M branch south of it to Sandborn, New Hampshire. They refuse to sell one small section of the mainline so everything else is growing over and weeding up except for the small portion run by the Conway Scenic through the Notch.

John

 

[masontaylor]

Surprised you didn't avail yourself of the Scotrail £10 anywhere return to do the trip, Bobby - I was away in rural France when the steam trips came up for sale, so missed out on them, but did the standard trip a couple of weeks ago while the weather was still fantastic, and the Borders landscape at its beautiful best. The main disappointment was the new infrastructure work, which all looks cheap and basically functional - the French would have done it so much better! But it's still great to see the line back in service, even if its present choice of terminus is somewhat strange.

As for the next project, it seems that much of the smart money's on a Leven/Methil Fife Line revival. Not only is it one of the largest conurbations in Scotland without a rail link, but the trackbed is still intact, and from what of it I've seen, at least some of its (albeit old and rusty) track is still in place. The existing junction with the ECML just north of the Fife Circle triangle between Kirkaldy and Markinch means that it would be possible to run services via Kirkaldy or Dunfermline (or indeed an out and back loop through both. Not as touristy as the Borders, but a far lower capital expenditure and a much larger potential population and passenger base. The first big stumbling block for the Waverley extension is the present use of the trackbed at Melrose for the bypass, necessitating either a totally fresh route either for the road or the railway, neither of which will be cheap or easy...

 

[dougtrain]

I lived in Galashiels when the line had already been closed but there was still hope that something could be done. I watched the track being lifted and removed and it was as if the life support system had been turned off. That would have been 1970-71 I think.

It would be good to put the line through to Carlisle so the ECML and WCML would link up on a diagonal giving more choice. One point to consider would be the state of the viaduct now, just beyond Tweedbank at caddonfoot I think (if my memory still works). For those that are not familiar with then it is similar to the Harry potter one. The cost of repair or replacement would be prohibitive.

It should never have been closed in the first place but no matter what country you hail from, we have all experienced the short-sighted and blinkered bureaucrats that go poking about on the railways making irresponsible decisions. How many times are lines reopened again when the old admin has gone and the new admin does not have egg on its face. Funny too, how they make it sound like it was their idea and nothing to do with public pressure or media coverage.

Doug

 

[rjhowie]

Yep, Mason you were right about what I should have done! As it happens i am gong to get myself a Seniors raicard for Scotland and every so often do a run to places haven't been for years and others have equally never got round to (!). Back round about 1975 and 6 I took my Boys' Brigade Company to Melrose before we started going to Ulster for years. Ine day my no 2 and I went up to Melrose Station which was still intact and think had been used by some small trader. Anyway we walked the route right into Galashiels and although the track was obviously gone the outlines still there. What did surprise u was that the old Galashiels station was still intact complete with all the routine signs for booking office, waiting rooms, etc. Fascinating. Going the other sie of Melrose is the empty viaduct and impressive as well.

Interesting what you say about Leven and a while ago someone was mooting St Andrews. I intend to go up from Glasgow to surpise my neice who lives inm Ballingry. Being a rail fan I will of course take the train to Edinburgh then onto the one for the Fife circle to Lochgelly about a mile and a half south of there.There asre places like you mention and the lines in the Buchan areas, etc where rail could be back. Your comment on the modernitity of the new Borders branch will be very true and shows how they kept in within budget!

Indeed when you remember how what is now called the Argyle underground line in Glasgow City was closed all those years ago and then later years brought it back and heavily used just goes to show. Any time I walked up a former trackbed especially when I once travelled on it is especially sad. Can well remember taking a youth group up to Balquidder station for the mile or so of a hike to get to the hostel in Balquidder village. A lovely route and station. Makes me sigh. Heym, maybe someone might be tempted to do the Borders on Trainz.....

 

[amigacooke]

YMakes me sigh. Heym, maybe someone might be tempted to do the Borders on Trainz.....

In this case I don't think you need to be delivered from temptation

This maybe of interest to you:

[video]http://5thcroydonbb.com/2015/05/14/pipes-drums-drummer-call/[/video]

 

[rjhowie]

Was interesting so well done amigacooke!

My own company had a flute and rum band and played at garden fetes, etc. Even led a battalion parade on one occasion.

 

[rjhowie]

Ther has been a rather unfortunate negative regarding the 30 plus mile re-opening. As many will know apart from the modern DMU's Scotrail had a steam train running occasionally as part of the opening weeks however it raised a problem. It seems that because of how dated the steam train is it deposits the lavatories directly onto the track unlike the modern situ. In turn this has meant working along the track to clean it up and the rail Union has been bemoaning about this. In turn the rail company has said that the train is now due to come off having been only a temporary thing.

On a wider note I watched the head of Network Rail in front of a House of Commons Committee and he stated how successful the Borders project was. It had been well planned, finished as per the date and within the cost. I bet the projected HS2 rail won't equal that!

 

[amigacooke]

My own company had a flute and rum band and played at garden fetes, etc. Even led a battalion parade on one occasion.

Flute I'm familiar with, but what is 'rum' in this context please?

 

[rjhowie]

Haha! Sorry about that amigacooke. It is not some local Glaswegian puzzle and just a missed "d." (!).

Many moons ago a Boy who joined the band wanted to play the cymbals and had a reputation for being mischievous. So I suggested he try to do the scale to see how he would get on while others kept a difficult straight face. I asked him to clang them once and he did and I said "good that is a doh." Then told him to do it twice telling that he had now played doh and ray. When it came a to a break shortly after he told his pals to watch how clever he was. He played the cymbals 8 times calling out "doh, ray, me fah" and so on. Everyone fell about laughing and he frowned and asked them why when he had only started and could do the scale on the cymbals right away!

 

[amigacooke]

That sounds about the scale of my musical achievement as well, I was so good I carried the company colour

 

[rjhowie]

I picked up a small news item today in a newspaper that unfortunately many would not notice. It was the Community Council in the town of Kelso stating that there should be a extension theirm way and to Berwick-on-Tweed.

Going back to your comment Mason on the Leven/Methil Fife Line that was interesting. Many have been the times I have walked former lines which always gave me a sad touch. Now I see what passes for a government in Edinburgh is on about the matter of a line from Glasgow Central to the aiprot. Bemusingly when they took over they cancelled the previous regime intnetion of doing that. Now they are wanting it!

Now I have my excellent Senior Rail card I am aiming for a 2 train journey to Edinburgh then up the Fife Circle to surprise a niece and family not seen for yonks! The Borders Line is on the list and a trip on the West Highland and other places not done for years are intended. Roll on the better weather as I have a lot to get back to.

 

[rjhowie]

Well the re-opening of this long line (or what originally went across the English Border) has turned out even better.

In the 6 months since over 30 miles were brought back from Edinburgh into the heart of the Borders region the target was 250,000 users but the end result has been twice that at 500,000 travellers. What a fantastic achievement and makes the decades of fighting a great end result. This may encourage the other towns beyond which still have the old trackbed there to do something more positive just like that team of locals who stuck to their aim. In practical terms the Edinburgh government may do a dance on that but when the present admin took over they scrubbed the intended line from Glasgow (Central) to Glasgow Airport but now they are gong to go with it!

Hopefully with an ease in the windy and wet conditions easing a bit I will train to Edinburgh for my run down to just beyond Galashiels. All those years ago at a Boys' Brigade camp at Melrose two of us walked part of that route and never thought a train service would ever come back! But waht the other towns beyond Galashiels need to do is have a really organised regular meeting group

Now there is talk of a shared cost between the UK and Scottish governments to share money going into north east Scotland with the way the oil industry has been shattered. So why don't they include the closed line north of Aberdeen to Peterhead and Fraserburgh? After all each of the re-opened including rural routes have beaten targets?

 

[nxn]

Has Anyone Modeled This Route?

I know this thread is going on 5 years old but I rode the line from Tweedbank into Edinburgh and back on a day trip on a visit to UK and Northumbria a few years ago and it's a very scenic line with interesting tunnels and viaducts and lots of small towns along the way. At 35 miles it would make an excellent Trainz project and I am wondering if anyone has or is doing it?