Amtrak train strikes a truck in Mansfield MA. 2 killed...

[JCitron]

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/two-killed-after-amtrak-train-hits-truck-near-boston/

The two people in the truck were killed by an Amtrak - Boston to Washington train around midnight. No other details other than it's a mess right now...

John

 

[gfisher]

Service resumed at 7:00AM this morning. No one on the train was injured.

 

[wholbr]

Now being reported that three have been killed all in uv truck. Condolences to family and friends of the deceased who's sorrow will be shared by rail travelers throughout the world.

Bill

 

[deneban]

Then another Amtrak train hit a tree-trimming truck less than 113 miles away in Berlin, CT @ 70 mph, injuring 5, 9:30 AM today. Connecticut service was suspended.

 

[gfisher]

who's sorrow will be shared by rail travelers throughout the world.

Well, I don't know about that. Apparently these brain trusts were out late at night driving their truck down the railroad track one half mile or more away from any access point. Good Darwin Award candidates if you ask me.

 

[hauntedclipp]

Looks like there wasn't much damage to that AEM-7, despite having hit the truck hard enough to derail it. My condolences to the families of those in the truck, despite their supposed stupidity.

So, the truck was driving on the tracks? Not hit at a crossing?
Very similar to a crash that happened here, on formerly-ATSF's Oceanside - Escodido branch. A drunk man drove his truck onto the tracks. When it got stuck, he left the truck and tried to flag down an oncoming NCTD Sprinter train. Of course, the train plowed right into the truck. Nobody was hurt, but the truck was smashed beyond recognition.
The next morning, they had live news coverage on TV of the crash site. I burst out laughing when the Sprinter train blew its horn in the middle of the broadcast and sauntered off toward Escondido, as if nothing had happened.
Aside from a few scratches, the unit was unharmed.

 

[deneban]

What is alarming is two collisions only 100 miles and 9-1/2 hours apart.

 

[wholbr]

Hi everybody.

Well, I don't know about that. Apparently these brain trusts were out late at night driving their truck down the railroad track one half mile or more away from any access point. Good Darwin Award candidates if you ask me.

Gfisher, obviously you did not read fully my posting at # three of this thread which I repost below.

Now being reported that three have been killed all in uv truck. Condolences to family and friends of the deceased who's sorrow will be shared by rail travellers throughout the world.

As you can see my condolences were posted to the family and friends of those killed in this incident who obviously had no input or connection with whatever events led to this tragedy. However, in such cases as these the family and acquaintances of the bereaved not only bear the grief of the loss of their loved ones (regardless circumstances) but also in many cases the severe financial hardship which often accompany such accidents.

Therefore in regard to the foregoing gfisher, if you cannot find it within yourself to offer sympathy and condolences to those who have suffered loss in this tragic incident I think many on this forum would find that very sad.

Also in your posting gfisher you seem to assume that all three in the road vehicle willingly concurred with whatever took place on the railway. As obviously only one person can be driving any vehicle at any given time it could well have been that the two passengers certainly did not wish to be involved in the actions of the driver.

In the foregoing it may well have been “a prank” Pulled by the driver on the other two passengers which went horribly wrong. Equally, the driver’s actions could have been far more sinister in its planning with regard to the outcome for himself, his passengers and those travelling on the train. In the latter there have been two such incidents on the British rail network in the past few years.

As someone who has carried out many accident investigations in the British road transport industry until recent retirement, I have always found that what is perceived at the start of an investigation often turns out to be very different from what is found at the end of an investigation.

Therefore, in cases such as this one the best action is to just give sympathy and condolences to the family of the bereaved and await the outcome of the accident investigation

Bill

 

[JCitron]

Bill and all,

I agree that we should send condolences to those people not involved in this incident and I do support the train crew who had to face this, and will face this incident for years to come through our overly litigious society. Even though these guys were found at fault, or at least the driver should be, the families will bring this incident to court and find some way to milk the MBTA, Amtrak, and every one else for every cent they can get out of them. Seriously... A few years a go a very drunk guy climbed up and touched the pantograph on a parked Acela train. He survived the zap from the overhead wires with some severe burns then went on to sue Amtrak for the injuries. This case was thrown out of court, but it goes to show what may come of this.

So sadly, like George I have little empathy for those directly involved other than the train crew who faced a truck directly in front of them on the ROW.

Regarding the tree-trimmer incident, these incidents occur quite often unfortunately, but don't get reported as much in the news as we see. From looking at a map of the area, I can't see how this happened since that ROW is quite wide. At one time this area was triple and double track that has now been single-tracked. There is more than enough room to drive a long the tracks. My speculation is the work crew did not place the necessary speed caution flags or notify the dispatcher of their whereabouts on the line.

At any rate, it will be interesting to see the outcome of both of these incidents. The best place to get more up-to-date information is the NTSB at www.ntsb.gov .

John

 

[wholbr]

John

Hi John and everybody.
John, apologies for not replying to your posting yesterday as I have been into watching the World Cup and very much enjoying all the matches (with the exception of England’s performance).

With regard to your comment regarding sympathy for those killed in the UV, then I would agree with you that no sympathy at all should be expressed for the driver of the vehicle as that person’s death was either an act of supreme stupidity or the deliberate manslaughter of his passengers accompanied by suicide with regard to the drivers own death.

With regard to litigation against the railway company, then I can only speak with regard to U.K litigation standards which have improved greatly in the recent year with regard to defending companies or persons. Obviously the train crew and passengers will be making claims against the railroad company for pain distress caused, delays to their journeys and loss of business/holidays etc. The railway company as normal will offset those claims with a claim against the insurers of the road vehicle. Likewise, next of kin to the passengers who were killed in the road vehicle will claim against the vehicles insurers who in turn may try to offset that claim with a claim against the railroad company.

In the above, traditionally such litigation can tie up all the parties involved with many months of work and high costs all to the benefit of solicitors and lawyers whose only interest is in prolonging the case for as long as possible to maximise their revenue. Undoubtedly in this case much will be debated on where the vehicle entered the railway, if it was clearly marked, if the signage was clearly illuminated at night, could a reasonable person have made a mistake of the type that was made, along with any other argument you can think of. These matters will be debated through the court over many days ,weeks and perhaps months before an eventual outcome is produced and closure brought.

However, in Britain hope sprang eternal in the last year when the Industrial Tribunal Courts (courts where employees can go with claims of unfair dismissal or discrimination) introduced deposit payments against persons applying for court hearings in what has become known as “no hope cases”. In the above both parties to the case have to produce to the tribunal chairman written statements in regard to the basis of their case and the evidence they have in support of that prior to the hearing. If the tribunal chairman feels that either one of the two parties does not have a reasonable case he can then demand a deposit of up to £1000 from the party with the weak case before they are allowed into court. On loss of the case the deposit is held permanently by the court and the losing party also has to pay the litigation costs of the other party as well as their own.

The above procedure has drastically reduced the number of cases going into the industrial courts to the benefit of everyone as no hope cases simply do not appear on the lists these days. Other courts in the UK are now considering introducing similar procedures.

Let’s hope the same procedure can be introduced in the American courts to the benefit of all there.

Bill

 

[PerRock]

In the US you're much less likely to see passengers and crew sue Amtrak, and much more likely to see the next of kin to the vehicle sue Amtrak. They usually come up with some odd clause as to why it's Amtrak's fault the car got hit. If you remember a few years ago a large truck in Nevada drove straight into the side of a moving Amtrak train; even after the NTSB ruled that basically the driver ignored everything and plowed into the train. The trucking company still sued Amtrak.

peter

 

[Railwoodman]

And losted, but suing anyone for almost anything is now not only done, sadly it's expected. Regardless of circumstance.

 

[wholbr]

Hi everybody.

In the US you're much less likely to see passengers and crew sue Amtrak, and much more likely to see the next of kin to the vehicle sue Amtrak. They usually come up with some odd clause as to why it's Amtrak's fault the car got hit. If you remember a few years ago a large truck in Nevada drove straight into the side of a moving Amtrak train; even after the NTSB ruled that basically the driver ignored everything and plowed into the train. The trucking company still sued Amtrak.

peter

Peter, I cannot see how any employee of Amtrak or any other company could do anything else but enter litigation against their employer if they are in any way injured (either mentally or physically) while working where no blame for the accident could be attached to themselves. Almost all accidents of any significance involve being unable to work and attending medical treatment at least for a period of time. Almost all employee workplace contracts state that sick pay is only available for a limited number of weeks and often no sick pay is available at all.

With the above in mind, an employee can do little else but make a claim against his employer for loss of earnings and medical costs regardless of whether thay consider thay are working for a good employer or bad. Also, many employers will encourage employees who have sustained injuries in the workplace to make a claim against them as that can then be handled under their employers liability insurance with all the necessary investigations and compensation payments ( if necessary) being totally in the hands of the underwriters.

In my experience the above is not a confrontational process between the employee and employer, but just part of due process when the employer/employee both consider that no safety regulations were broken by either party and the accident was unavoidable and non-blameworthy on their part.

And losted, but suing anyone for almost anything is now not only done, sadly it's expected. Regardless of circumstance.

Railwoodman, there is nothing wrong in anyone entering into litigation especially in circumstances such as I have described above. However, what is wrong is very often the way that litigation claims are handled by the legal profession and courts. Solicitors very often take up to 3 months to reply to claims made and letter sent and then charge fantastic fees for just replying to the correspondence.

Plaintiffs and defendants in court cases will also go to all sorts of lengths just to delay the legal process and in that the deny justice to those who have a solid and justifiable case. Due diligence and justice is the right of everyone in a free society. However, that right is very often abused by plaintiffs, defendants and the justice system itself as money seems often to be more important than quick and efficient settlement of cases.

That said, the law was there to protect us all even with all its faults.

Bill

 

[JCitron]

Hi Bill,

In the US, employees rarely enter into litigation with their employer unless there are some truly undue circumstances that were truly out of the ordinary or due to being forced to work in unsafe conditions. Here in the US, in addition to regular time off and sick time, major employers such as Amtrak, have to purchase workmen's compensation insurance. This insurance will cover costs and even pay employees for any on-the-job accidents. The employee usually will collect from this first before regular sick time and collecting this does not affect the terms of employment, currently earned vacation time, or earned sick days. If there are severe injuries to put an employee out of work permanently, then he or she would be placed on short term then long term disability prior to going on the national, Social Security disability. In the case of railroad employees, they don't pay into the Social Security system and instead would receive payments from the National Railroad Retirement Act.

Since no passengers or crew were injured in the train vs passenger SUV collision, there should be no litigation on this matter.

There has been an update... There were two males and one female killed in the accident. All were in the SUV. The men were in their mid-20s (24/26 years old). They have been identified, however, the woman has not. She's probably in the same age group, my assumption. The current question is why were they driving down the eastbound tracks which is being investigated now.

John