April 27th, 2012, 08:36 AM
big routes - playability
In the last time we got a lot of big routes, ECML, WM&B&O Mega route, Moscow-Maloyar, Lublin-Dorohusk, UMR.
They are very long and the time we need to reach the end of the route is going on tens of the hours.
What to do that running this kind of the routes will not be boring.
Last edited by celje; April 29th, 2012 at 05:22 AM.
April 27th, 2012, 09:36 AM
Horses for courses. Some people like longer prototypical runs, rather than pootling round an expanded model railway.
Of course this is one area would benefit from a more structured player/timetable scenario creation utility to add extra purpose to making the run, but we haven't got that yet in over 10 years of the programme, so just relax, drive and enjoy the scenery!
April 27th, 2012, 10:24 AM
That's my purpose, to support this kind of proposal, after 10 years it's time for something fresh, new or add-on. Long routes need new or additional approach.
Originally Posted by Vern
Last edited by celje; April 27th, 2012 at 10:36 AM.
April 27th, 2012, 11:09 AM
One thing to do is makes short session (1hr or less) and then string them together. In MStrain there is a group that set up a virtual railroad (NERR) where work orders (sessions) could be run. These session could be switching in a yard, pick ups and drop offs, or just long distance runs. So on a route like the umr you could start in smithville yard making a consist in one session, run to Grantly in a second and do some drops. Next sessions could move you down the line to set up local pickups. The advantage of this is you can use a lot of ai traffic that can be passed by the player train. And a story and you have a nice group of sessions that can use the whole route or multiple routes.
I downloaded your session last week and ran it for a couple of hours. It ran well but with the weakness of TS12 save function I doubt it would go the full 14hrs.
April 28th, 2012, 12:26 PM
My own route is over 150-plus miles long, but I don't usually run over the whole length myself. I have AI drivers setup to run the length of the route. As they run along, they interact with my own running which is done around a local freight operation or commuter trains. My commuter trains, for example run either in loops or on an out and back from a station. With the AI-controlled commuter trains doing one thing along with the long AI-controlled freights, I busy myself with other operations myself. Other than the long distance passenger trains or long run-through freights, none of the trains run for more than 1 hour schedules max. I have plenty to do keeping everyone operating the way they should. Occasionally I will take over one of the long distance running trains for something different and this can be a few hours' journey to the other side of my map.
Now one of the things with a large map, is you need a purpose. My route is based on a theme which I setup many years ago and over time I have kept pretty consistent. This part in its self is quite a challenge because as we build a large route. Over time I have abandoned routes, added track in, revised track, and even chopped baseboards that I felt didn't add to the purpose. With abandoned lines, I will leave portions of them where they cross mainlines or branch off towards where they used to go. I will downgrade the track to rusty rails, put trees in the trackbed, and rip up junctions in places to make the area look like there was once a branch line or mainline that once ran in the area.
The benefits of running a long distance route in Trainz is truly one of the greatest things with this hobby. We don't have to worry about maintenance on such a large route. In a real model, for example we would be constantly cleaning and maintaining the route which can take more time than just using the trains. We also don't have the space issue which has always been a concern for real models.
Trainz User ID: 124863
April 28th, 2012, 01:28 PM
What I have done is have 1 main route operating 3 RR's, BNSF, UP, & NS with a port theme somewhere on the Grate Lakes. So as not to bog down the frame rates I have kept each RR down to max of 20 miles each. All loop back or option to an IPortal. Each RR has a separate bare route that act as staging yards for the main route, so I have 4 interactive routes all connected via IPortals. The main route has a 6 track stub-end passenger terminal with one daily Amtrak and 4 commuter trains that are all AI controlled and take less than 45 min to do a round trip. It's a challenge to get the freights to work the local industry while dodging the commuters. What I would like to see is a car forwarding system that is a lot simple to use, somewhat like the MR card card system.
April 29th, 2012, 06:06 AM
The purpose, this is the good point, but what it mean.
The example of good purpose is powerstation. With rule you can set that, without electricity, some things don't work.
Bad example: trains works nonstop without consuming fuel.
Now we have the chain: production, transport, consume, waybills, scores. The first four use quantity (tones, litres, items) but Scores are not connected with this chain ( of course if they work, in TS12 they don't).
Our challange in the session is limited with the time and scores. I think that's enough, i don't like that we would have money involved.
When the cargo is delivered we have no information, we need popup window, that delivered was made, e.g. 60 items of general goods was delivered in Warehouse XY (60/240). scores 60, all scores 60/2000.
MounE is talking about short sessions, it's no need, in Schedule library we can make the different schedules for one train, it's only the matter of timing.
It seems that in big route we must learn to use save after two, three hours running.
Last edited by celje; April 29th, 2012 at 03:44 PM.
April 29th, 2012, 12:17 PM
What I mean by a purpose, is a reason for the route to be there. A power plant can be one part of a larger picture. In my case it was once textile mills that required rail service to a port. Today the small company took over the running of some additional local lines, thus my much larger route today. The rails now host various equipment ranging from Amtrak through passenger trains, commuters, through freights, and some local switching.
Yes saving is a good thing when running sessions. I've learned the hard way too many times!
A good example of a running on my route consists of shunting freight cars in a flat yard to get them ready for one of the through AI freights. In the process of readying the cars, commuter trains go through and there is the AI-driven freight which I stop and take over. I wait until the two commuter trains clear, pull the engines through, and pick-up the additional cars. This is done quickly because there are additional commuter trains coming along afterwards. Once all the cars are hooked on, I let the AI driver continue his schedule, and I drive a local to nearby town to drop off some cars at the local industries there.
This operation can take a couple of hours and in the first part, my palms have gotten sweaty when I've been nervous trying to avoid the mainline traffic.
Trainz User ID: 124863
April 29th, 2012, 12:29 PM
Without purpose, IMHO, we would be just playing trains. My only problem is that I never seem to finish my route, every-time someone crates a new industry/building, I gottta have it. With rolling stock all I have to do is add via an IPortal from one of the satellite/yard routes.
April 29th, 2012, 03:42 PM
All the time i have the bad feeling that something is missing in the session.
Jcitron, your example, shunting and then proceeding with AI.
My example, last session for ECML, four hours that AI train deliver steel coil in Newcastle.
Is this kind of purpose enough?
Are we need some kind of the different challange?