bigboy4014
East Broad Top Historian
one rule i've learned in my life...never trust you sister when she says "you'll be safe"
East Broad Top RR in Trainz a WIP (Large Pics - Yes)
- Thread starter RPearson
- Start date
one rule i've learned in my life...never trust you sister when she says "you'll be safe"
cascaderailroad
New member
This is one reason I have given up on Trainz ... people wanting something ... something that they can not do for themselves ... so they ask of others ... to do their bidding for them
Well the wye at Neelyton is there on my route at least the main and nw legs. I always leave 1 spline section out where a turning loop is formed due to the logic I programmed into the Cad2trk utility in setting track directions. I know I put the NE leg in the wye at Shade Gap when I did some coarse terraforming to match the grades built into the track. But you might have to wait a bit as I didn't take No 17 that far.
Re the gators - I was close enough to 2 smaller ones to get some really nice pics. Some other people went up a lot closer - me I just preferred to zoom in with the camera lense, thank you, that was all the closeness I needed. When we got there, there were about 2 dozen larger ones on the other side of the small dam. The pics I took of them were looking right into the sun so they're not as impressive.
@Cascaderr - are you still interested in the 04 version we talked about? The cdp is about 33 megs. PM me.
Bob Pearson
Re the gators - I was close enough to 2 smaller ones to get some really nice pics. Some other people went up a lot closer - me I just preferred to zoom in with the camera lense, thank you, that was all the closeness I needed. When we got there, there were about 2 dozen larger ones on the other side of the small dam. The pics I took of them were looking right into the sun so they're not as impressive.
@Cascaderr - are you still interested in the 04 version we talked about? The cdp is about 33 megs. PM me.
Bob Pearson
bigboy4014
East Broad Top Historian
This is one reason I have given up on Trainz ... people wanting something ... something that they can not do for themselves ... so they ask of others ... to do their bidding for them
well it's not my fault that your decided to work on the project to begin with and then decide to opt out not even halfway through, and it's not like i haven't done anything for this project myself, what about all the information that i've compiled for people like you, bendorsey and chance clayton so that
1. you had all the things you needed to build the map
2. so bendorsey had all the stufs needed to build the buildings accurately.
3. chance had the necessary components needed to build the EBT mikado's from scratch.
before you open your mouth think about how i made so much of this project possible at the risk of my own life.
well it's not my fault that your decided to work on the project to begin with and then decide to opt out not even halfway through, and it's not like i haven't done anything for this project myself, what about all the information that i've compiled for people like you, bendorsey and chance clayton so that
1. you had all the things you needed to build the map
2. so bendorsey had all the stufs needed to build the buildings accurately.
3. chance had the necessary components needed to build the EBT mikado's from scratch.
before you open your mouth think about how i made so much of this project possible at the risk of my own life.
bigboy4014
East Broad Top Historian
bob i would also like to have a copy of that map to play around with since clearly the project i was working on no longer exists
cascaderailroad
New member
So you claim to do all the research ... And I do all the hard work on tracklaying ?
And I owe you this route, and owe you continual work ... for free ... as I am not getting paid by you, at all.
You sound just a tad demanding ... for someone who can't lay your own track ... and you depend on others to do all the hard tracklaying work for you.
I just got sick and tired of all your continual, perpetual, demands, and all of your tyranical rants, demanding of me, that we get the work done by a certain date, ... I am sure that Bendorsey got a tad tired of 40 continual E-Mails per day, telling him his work was wrong, demanding that he re-do something, that he already fixed 5 times previously, for you ... So I don't work for you anymore ... DIY !
Bob: The 04 route would probably give me ideas on what things I have wrong ... but then again I won't be editing your 04 route ... So, It really doesn't matter ... I have the whole EBT RR route in 06.
Great work though, Bob ... Keep posting screenshots !
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bigboy4014
East Broad Top Historian
cascaderailroad
New member
Grow up ... Take in the big world ... and get a life outside of the EBT RR ... I think you are just a tad infatuated, and totally madly obsessed about this EBT RR rail line ... Whether I have it running ... That does not make, or break my life ... It's just a virtual line of curves and straights, on a PC monitor ... It's not even real ... It's just a video game simulator.
It's not like the route, and all my hard work, is going to get me any recognition, nor make me rich and famous with the FEBT Society.
Here's an idea: Maybe I could give away my route to the FEBT, and they could sell it, to raise the $600,000 they owe in Pa tax's this April
It's not like the route, and all my hard work, is going to get me any recognition, nor make me rich and famous with the FEBT Society.
Here's an idea: Maybe I could give away my route to the FEBT, and they could sell it, to raise the $600,000 they owe in Pa tax's this April
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Hey guys, we all have problems so leave them at home please. When I get back from Florida I'll see if I can upload the 04 version so you can dl it if you want. The route is pretty close to the track shown of the original 1917 survey maps for the ICC. I have every turnout, curve and siding shown on them in the trk plan and most at the track distance indicated on the maps from the Mt Union reference 0 mark.
Some things had to be moved a bit or fudged here or there. I didn't use any curved turnouts and from what I can see the EBT used a number of them. Frog no was guessed at and probably a little smaller than actual in many cases. Actual fit to the terrain is questionable in a few areas but the actual grades, locations where the grades changed and vertical transition curves between them where held to as accurately as I could. The height data was taken from the set of companion ICC survey maps detailing the grades. These are all in the cad drawings I made of the route and branch lines and written directly into the trk file made with my Cad2trk utility. In fact once I get the track (with builtin grades) positioned on the terrrain it becomes the reference for just about all else and the terrain is adjusted to it.
In my own critique of the route to date I find a lot of areas for improvement. I'll almost guarantee a new version will begin with the issue of Tane later this year. The new track and turnout improvements talked about might just make it a certainty. I have TransDem 2.5 to try out now and with the route dxf files I should be able to georeference the track to the terrain very closely.
Bob Pearson
Some things had to be moved a bit or fudged here or there. I didn't use any curved turnouts and from what I can see the EBT used a number of them. Frog no was guessed at and probably a little smaller than actual in many cases. Actual fit to the terrain is questionable in a few areas but the actual grades, locations where the grades changed and vertical transition curves between them where held to as accurately as I could. The height data was taken from the set of companion ICC survey maps detailing the grades. These are all in the cad drawings I made of the route and branch lines and written directly into the trk file made with my Cad2trk utility. In fact once I get the track (with builtin grades) positioned on the terrrain it becomes the reference for just about all else and the terrain is adjusted to it.
In my own critique of the route to date I find a lot of areas for improvement. I'll almost guarantee a new version will begin with the issue of Tane later this year. The new track and turnout improvements talked about might just make it a certainty. I have TransDem 2.5 to try out now and with the route dxf files I should be able to georeference the track to the terrain very closely.
Bob Pearson
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bigboy4014
East Broad Top Historian
alright sounds good to me
Well by special request we'll take a quick look at the wye's at Shade Gap and Neelyton which also marked the starts of the Shade Valley Branch and the Neelyton Rock Spur. The 1st pic is a map view showing the extent of the EBT branch lines to the east. The EBT's South Penn Extension was graded in anticipation of a connection with the never built South Pennsylvania RR. The EBT never layed tracks on it but I layed tracks to the end of the ROW at Tuscorora Tunnel - one of 2 long tunnels bored for the South Penn but never used for railroad traffic.
Probably at some time in the near future I'll place each branch line on it's own layer so we'll see how that plays out. In fact I will most likely take some liberties with the time lines of the branch lines as none survived with the main except for small sections of the Clay Spur and the Shade Gap Branch at the connections with the main line. Since the branch lines were built at different times and had their track remove at different times in the EBT's history the entire railroad shown in the maps so far never existed at one time. Only the main line track was on the ground from start to finsh of service.
The map is rotated counterclockwise like the others with north to the left and south to the right. This shows all the branches going east from Orbisonia.
This is the wye at Shade Gap. The track to the left is the Shade Gap Branch going to Orbisonia, to the right it continues to Neelyton. The track going to the northeast (north is towards the top in this pic) is the Shade Valley Branch. The mountain ridge near the top actually running sw to ne is Shade Mountain.
This is the wye at Neelyton. Towards the left is the Shade Gap Branch towards Shade Gap. To the right, the Shade Gap Branch continues a short distance to the end of the ROW. The track to the north (north is towards the top left corner in this pic) is the Neelyton Rock Spur that goes on to the rock quarry located at Stantion. The mountain ridge to the right is Tuscorora Mountain.
Next time we'll get back to the main line starting south of Rockhill and maybe go as far as the town of Three Springs. That will leave almost half the main line track still to be explored and a good stopping point for a while.
Bob Pearson
Probably at some time in the near future I'll place each branch line on it's own layer so we'll see how that plays out. In fact I will most likely take some liberties with the time lines of the branch lines as none survived with the main except for small sections of the Clay Spur and the Shade Gap Branch at the connections with the main line. Since the branch lines were built at different times and had their track remove at different times in the EBT's history the entire railroad shown in the maps so far never existed at one time. Only the main line track was on the ground from start to finsh of service.
The map is rotated counterclockwise like the others with north to the left and south to the right. This shows all the branches going east from Orbisonia.
This is the wye at Shade Gap. The track to the left is the Shade Gap Branch going to Orbisonia, to the right it continues to Neelyton. The track going to the northeast (north is towards the top in this pic) is the Shade Valley Branch. The mountain ridge near the top actually running sw to ne is Shade Mountain.
This is the wye at Neelyton. Towards the left is the Shade Gap Branch towards Shade Gap. To the right, the Shade Gap Branch continues a short distance to the end of the ROW. The track to the north (north is towards the top left corner in this pic) is the Neelyton Rock Spur that goes on to the rock quarry located at Stantion. The mountain ridge to the right is Tuscorora Mountain.
Next time we'll get back to the main line starting south of Rockhill and maybe go as far as the town of Three Springs. That will leave almost half the main line track still to be explored and a good stopping point for a while.
Bob Pearson
trainman7616
Western Maryland Addict
Walter, if this is truely the way you are going to treat cascade after what he has done to help you then you can forget about the locomotives, and to think I was working on them in private as a surprise but forget it. I have no use for them so Im gonna stop what I'm doing with them and focus on Frisco.
I agree with cascade that you're obsessed with the EBT. The route you want made is huge, it takes determination and free time to do so. I am only able to work on the engines because I dont have a job yet. Get a grip on reality man. You chill out for a bit. Apologize to cascade and maybe I will continue working on the engines. There is no set deadline for a project this big.
Just incase you or anyone says I cant quit on the engines because you requested them. Wrong. If Im the one making them, I decide when to work on them. Truelly I dont really care for the EBT, I just thought I would help a friend, but if you are gonna act like a spoiled child then I am done with this project.
As for RPearson, great work so far on such a huge route. Once I get my projects done. I can redo some engines for you Bob.
I agree with cascade that you're obsessed with the EBT. The route you want made is huge, it takes determination and free time to do so. I am only able to work on the engines because I dont have a job yet. Get a grip on reality man. You chill out for a bit. Apologize to cascade and maybe I will continue working on the engines. There is no set deadline for a project this big.
Just incase you or anyone says I cant quit on the engines because you requested them. Wrong. If Im the one making them, I decide when to work on them. Truelly I dont really care for the EBT, I just thought I would help a friend, but if you are gonna act like a spoiled child then I am done with this project.
As for RPearson, great work so far on such a huge route. Once I get my projects done. I can redo some engines for you Bob.
cascaderailroad
New member
I have viewed your work ... and your 3D creation skills are fabulous ... Take your time, and please continue on 
I continue to work on 4 routes:
EBT RR
PRR-Enola to Pitcairn (the later was once the largest PA PRR classification yard prior to the construction of Conway and Enola)
ALCO Land-Hump Yard
Dolley Varden Mines .... Gorre and Daphitid
I continue to work on 4 routes:
EBT RR
PRR-Enola to Pitcairn (the later was once the largest PA PRR classification yard prior to the construction of Conway and Enola)
ALCO Land-Hump Yard
Dolley Varden Mines .... Gorre and Daphitid
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Thanks for the encouragement Trainman - one step at atime.
@Cascader - keep plugging my friend. I burned out a few times working on too many Trainz projects at the same time along with my own real life problems. So far I've always come back to the EBT route. I may never finish it - to my satisfaction - but I always enjoy working on it and to me that's the key thought here. We don't get paid for this, it's a work of love. It's always nice to get comments that indicate people appreciate the effort expended but I'll continue on regardless - so should you. You do some great work. I saw right away that Surveyor wasn't the end all tool for me to create routes in. Too much art and not enough surveying and engineering. But we make do with what we have. Every route is somebodys interpretation of a fictional or real railroad in some respect. even mine as close as I've tried to follow the data in the survey maps.
Bob Pearson
@Cascader - keep plugging my friend. I burned out a few times working on too many Trainz projects at the same time along with my own real life problems. So far I've always come back to the EBT route. I may never finish it - to my satisfaction - but I always enjoy working on it and to me that's the key thought here. We don't get paid for this, it's a work of love. It's always nice to get comments that indicate people appreciate the effort expended but I'll continue on regardless - so should you. You do some great work. I saw right away that Surveyor wasn't the end all tool for me to create routes in. Too much art and not enough surveying and engineering. But we make do with what we have. Every route is somebodys interpretation of a fictional or real railroad in some respect. even mine as close as I've tried to follow the data in the survey maps.
Bob Pearson
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Warning - off topic post
Pardon the extended absence but I haven't been involved with Trainz to any great extent since I left for Buffalo, NY last spring. Those of you who saw a few pics, in another thread, of the wooden sailboat I started restoring 2 yrs ago will be happy to know that my wife and I did manage to motor from RCR Marina in Buffalo's outer harbor down to Greenwich, NJ on the Cohansey River off Delaware Bay. A great trip thru the New York State Barge (Erie) Canal into the Hudson River and eventually down the Jersey Coast and into Delaware Bay. My wife went as far as Atlantic Highlands, NJ where she got off and our son John got on for the last leg of the trip. Both masts were stowed on deck the whole trip and to my surprise and great relief the old 2 cylinder 10 hp gas engine managed to power us the whole way. Log showed just over 650 nm when we tied up in Greenwich. That's just under 750 miles for those nautically challenged individuals among us.
Unfortunately the only casualty of the trip so to speak was the laptop I ran Trainz on. I used it to hold and display the NOAA raster chart catalog for the trip and until we left the Cape May Canal and headed up Delaware Bay I had no problems with it. With the wind out of the NW the Bay can be a bit choppy and heading up the Bay you can't avoid heading right into it. At some point I went below to check the chart and the bowsprit nosed into a wave and when she came back up flung enough spray to drench my son who was in the cockpit steering. The laptop, sitting on the berth below the open slide hatch, didn't get a lot of water dripping on it but probably it doesn't take much salt water to short something out. My son dried off, changed his shirt and was fine - the laptop hasn't started up since. I managed to save both HD's from the laptop but the new lap top I acquired since didn't have an optical drive until I got an external one a couple weeks ago. Loading TS12 and my various backups DVDs wasn't attempted. Besides I was busy doing other things since that happened.
I'll be checking into the forums from time to time in the near future. I see my inbox has some unanswered mail in it - apologies to all who were hoping for replies. I was discussing some scripting problems with Ben Neal the other day. Maybe I can ease back into things thinking about them - at least until the snow disappears and temperatures warm up enough to start getting the boat ready to launch this spring!
Regards,
Bob Pearson
As I retreat back into the Grey Mist ... sometime in the not too distant past I seem to recall an idyllic journey traveling the length of an engineering marvel of the 19th century. If it weren't for a handful of pictures taken along the way I might think it was all just a dream:
Pardon the extended absence but I haven't been involved with Trainz to any great extent since I left for Buffalo, NY last spring. Those of you who saw a few pics, in another thread, of the wooden sailboat I started restoring 2 yrs ago will be happy to know that my wife and I did manage to motor from RCR Marina in Buffalo's outer harbor down to Greenwich, NJ on the Cohansey River off Delaware Bay. A great trip thru the New York State Barge (Erie) Canal into the Hudson River and eventually down the Jersey Coast and into Delaware Bay. My wife went as far as Atlantic Highlands, NJ where she got off and our son John got on for the last leg of the trip. Both masts were stowed on deck the whole trip and to my surprise and great relief the old 2 cylinder 10 hp gas engine managed to power us the whole way. Log showed just over 650 nm when we tied up in Greenwich. That's just under 750 miles for those nautically challenged individuals among us.
Unfortunately the only casualty of the trip so to speak was the laptop I ran Trainz on. I used it to hold and display the NOAA raster chart catalog for the trip and until we left the Cape May Canal and headed up Delaware Bay I had no problems with it. With the wind out of the NW the Bay can be a bit choppy and heading up the Bay you can't avoid heading right into it. At some point I went below to check the chart and the bowsprit nosed into a wave and when she came back up flung enough spray to drench my son who was in the cockpit steering. The laptop, sitting on the berth below the open slide hatch, didn't get a lot of water dripping on it but probably it doesn't take much salt water to short something out. My son dried off, changed his shirt and was fine - the laptop hasn't started up since. I managed to save both HD's from the laptop but the new lap top I acquired since didn't have an optical drive until I got an external one a couple weeks ago. Loading TS12 and my various backups DVDs wasn't attempted. Besides I was busy doing other things since that happened.
I'll be checking into the forums from time to time in the near future. I see my inbox has some unanswered mail in it - apologies to all who were hoping for replies. I was discussing some scripting problems with Ben Neal the other day. Maybe I can ease back into things thinking about them - at least until the snow disappears and temperatures warm up enough to start getting the boat ready to launch this spring!
Regards,
Bob Pearson
As I retreat back into the Grey Mist ... sometime in the not too distant past I seem to recall an idyllic journey traveling the length of an engineering marvel of the 19th century. If it weren't for a handful of pictures taken along the way I might think it was all just a dream:
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cascaderailroad
New member
So we're going to have to put the PA State System canal back in for you, so you can sail up the Juniata river to Hollidaysburg, and go overland via the Allegheny Portage Inclined Plane RR to Johnstown, and then you can float yer' boat down to Pittsburgh, and on to St Louis, to New Orleans
Railwoodman
Well-known member
Love your boat, Sailing was and is a great love also. Was wondering why this thread had seemed to die off, now I fully understand.
TANE has arrived 8-(((((
It looks like I have a lot of extra work just to get back to even.
Texture problems.
Script problems.
Content problems.
NO STEAM LOCOS allowed on the test track problems - I was looking forward to that one too.
1st pic below is taken in TS12.
2nd one - identical consist and location on route. Ouch. 8-(
I thought if it displayed in TS12 SP1 correctly it should work in TANE. I was obviously mistaken. TANE is the worst transition so far. At least everything displayed correctly from TRS04 thru TS12. Unfortunately there will be no port of the current EBT route to TANE for development work. There's just too much to do to get it all back working and frankly I don't have the time.
In TANE, EBT No 17 loco's script that controls exhaust velocity, color, size and textures did not link with the loco - no errors indicated it just couldn't link. I saw no obvious reason either (works fine in TS12) but there was a lot of commenting out of old code in it and I spent the time to clean things up. When it finally did link up I find it's broken in TANE because they broke all the SetpfxEmiters() methods it depends upon to control the particle effects. In TANE my EBT Nos 8-11 passenger coaches (repaints of Whitepass's WP&Y passenger coach) didn't look like what you see above. The last 3 updates of the base model they alias are a different car completely no idea when that happened - maybe a part of the DLS clean up for TANE??? In TS12 it picks out ver 1 of the car which displays correctly. In TANE it uses ver 4 - a completely different mesh and no texture replacements are made. I fixed them (forced them to use ver 1 of the original model) but it took a while. The EBT hoppers are broken too. Hard to see in the above but the bogeys and various parts of the car are there except they're no longer connected as a integral railcar - the parts are displaced from where they were in TS12. Not my content unfortunately so I'll have to wait for Randal to find the time to fix them.
1st time I've really been discouraged with the route. Bummer 8-(
Regards,
Bob Pearson
It looks like I have a lot of extra work just to get back to even.
Texture problems.
Script problems.
Content problems.
NO STEAM LOCOS allowed on the test track problems - I was looking forward to that one too.
1st pic below is taken in TS12.
2nd one - identical consist and location on route. Ouch. 8-(
I thought if it displayed in TS12 SP1 correctly it should work in TANE. I was obviously mistaken. TANE is the worst transition so far. At least everything displayed correctly from TRS04 thru TS12. Unfortunately there will be no port of the current EBT route to TANE for development work. There's just too much to do to get it all back working and frankly I don't have the time.
In TANE, EBT No 17 loco's script that controls exhaust velocity, color, size and textures did not link with the loco - no errors indicated it just couldn't link. I saw no obvious reason either (works fine in TS12) but there was a lot of commenting out of old code in it and I spent the time to clean things up. When it finally did link up I find it's broken in TANE because they broke all the SetpfxEmiters() methods it depends upon to control the particle effects. In TANE my EBT Nos 8-11 passenger coaches (repaints of Whitepass's WP&Y passenger coach) didn't look like what you see above. The last 3 updates of the base model they alias are a different car completely no idea when that happened - maybe a part of the DLS clean up for TANE??? In TS12 it picks out ver 1 of the car which displays correctly. In TANE it uses ver 4 - a completely different mesh and no texture replacements are made. I fixed them (forced them to use ver 1 of the original model) but it took a while. The EBT hoppers are broken too. Hard to see in the above but the bogeys and various parts of the car are there except they're no longer connected as a integral railcar - the parts are displaced from where they were in TS12. Not my content unfortunately so I'll have to wait for Randal to find the time to fix them.
1st time I've really been discouraged with the route. Bummer 8-(
Regards,
Bob Pearson
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cascaderailroad
New member
It is a shame that T:ANE checks for so many errors ... I mean, Why doesn't the game just let all the stuff into the game, with all the errors. TS10, and TS12 were bad enough, but T:ANE breaks just about everything it touches. I'm sure that many of these things are easily fixed, by manually editing config files, and fixing those missing ground textures. What T:ANE needs is a CMP that edits and fixes assets for you, automatically, or an external program that does fix assets for the way too picky T:ANE
TRS2006 used to be fun, almost everything worked right out of the box ... Now it seems T:ANE is a heartbreak, and a total chore of a job, instead of being a fun hobby, that runs right out of the box.
TRS2006 used to be fun, almost everything worked right out of the box ... Now it seems T:ANE is a heartbreak, and a total chore of a job, instead of being a fun hobby, that runs right out of the box.
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