Starting a route using Google Earth/maps

F

flatlander

New member
A month ago I purchased a new copy of TRS2006 , and have driven some of the routes that come with the application, and I have created a small layout from scratch to use as a learning tool.

But I'd like to model a couple routes in the same area of Illinois, especially East Central Illinois where you would find ICG, Illinois Terminal, and C&EI. What would be the right approach be to begin the process?

I found a good post on the forum which explained how to convert a Google Earth image to a Trainz route, but it takes a couple steps which didn't scare me. I'd like the challenge.

Would it be better to start with what I know, what I see, and do some local research and take it from there, or would it be worth my time to learn how to import Google Earth images and start 'the right way'? I'm looking at the area around and between two towns about 40 miles apart.

There are so many good posts on this site, but I haven't been able to craft my question in a way to turn up a good answer for this. Comments and thoughts would be appreciated.
 
Not sure on what the post was you read but I can give a quick explanation of how I use Google Earth when creating a route.

On the DLS is a great set of assets called - 1km Basemap - by Halfdan, there are several on the DLS as they have a letter or number after the title so you can use more than one at a time.
Link - http://www.auran.com/TRS2004/DLS_viewasset.php?AssetID=154712

With these you need a 1km square image from Google Earth, the way I do it is I use the Ruler tool in GE set to Kilometres, lay 2 rulers (1 North to South, 1 East to West) so they form 2 sides of a box. As I am using Windows 7 I use the built in Screen Grab tool, "Snipping Tool" found in the Accessories Menu. Make sure that GE is at full screen and turn off all the label options, also zoom in so you can just see the rulers. Use the snipping tool to select the area around the rulers and you get yourself a nice square section of land.

The image you just "Snipped" will need to be resized in a Graphics editor, something like GIMP will do or if you have Photoshop handy that is just as good. Re-size the image so it is 1024 pixels by 1024 pixels and then save it. Open up the 1km Basemap for edit and replace the texture file with the "Snipped" image, making sure you rename it to the correct title (i.e. 1km Basemap A.jpg). Save and Commit the asset and then load up TRS.

From within Surveyor you will find the Basemap in the Objects tab (F3) and then place it like any other object. I also find if I lower the height of the Basemap it doesn't block the view of any roads or tracks I lay.

Hope this helps.

Nathan
 
Hi jalandis.

Welcome to Trainz (also known to many as the "time-pit"!)

To add to Napalm's excellent advice, try this tutorial.

It worked for me. I got to grips with basemaps for the first time last month and found the tutorial both invaluable and easy to follow.

http://www.g0akh.f2s.com/Trainz/Basemap_tutorial.html

Cheers
Casper
:)


Edit: I note that you have TRS2006. Unless you have an FCT, you won't be able to use the Auran Download Station to get the basmap kuid's. However, the link I posted above contains another link from which you can get a direct download.

.
 
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Thanks to both of you for your wonderful input. When I told my wife I bought the software, she just rolled her eyes knowing that hours would be spent working on it. But that's ok, I'm looking forward to creating my first real route and can do it in the family room. So many people have created and posted pics of their routes that it's an inspiration to move forward.

Napalm, your instructions are pretty straight forward. I'm not a big Paint Shop expert, but I have a fairly recent version loaded and I can get around in it. The rest will just have to be learned.

I am running this on an HP 8530p business class laptop on Win 7 64 bit with 4GB of RAM. Even though the limitation is that TRS2006 is only single threaded, I'm probably going to upgrade to 2009 or 2010 to take advantage of the Core Duo technology. The 2006 app seems to run at an acceptable rate, although if it was a first-person shooter game I'd expect much better.

Casper, I went to your link and found what you pointed me to. I'll wait until later when I can get on my personal laptop and get that process started.

Thanks again,

- Jim
 
Hey Jim,

All you really need the graphics software for is to resize the image you capture from GE so any should do it.

As a guide to what you can achieve with Basemaps, here is a quick screenshot of my current little project in TS2009, I'm going to get TS2010 at the end of the month when we get paid as it has some extra benefits in there.

Steelworks1.jpg


Nathan
 
That looks like a great start! Keep us posted.

You may know about it, but if you like to use real measurements, I just found in Google Maps a measurement tool in the "new" section with the green beaker, just beside "my profile" on the top right of the Google Maps page. If you enable it and save it, you'll have to refresh Google Maps. Then you'll find a strange looking icon on the bottom left corner beside the scale. If you click that you can turn the measurement tool on and off.

I used it to measure an existing but abandoned Conrail ladder in our home town which will be part of what I'm going to model. Google said it is 3881' long. The measurement tool even came to within 3' of how long my home actually is, so I think it's probably a good tool to throw in the toolbox.
 
Thanks.

Nice tip about the measurement tool in Google Maps, I have the Full Google Earth app and it has various measurement tools built in to it.

Nathan
 
Gents, I love the method you described! I downloaded and committed the 9 grids and located them in my program folders. So now tomorrow night I hope to start my first layout.

In the link that mezzoprezzo posted the author says to put the 9 grids up then trace what you want, and then take the baseboards off. It appears from his pictures, that Napalm put the baseboards on his layout and just started building. Is just building and not tracing the recommended or best method?

If you have to trace, I couldn't find a tool to trace with. Anyway this will be a nice start.

Thanks again!
-Jim
 
Hey Jim, it's up to you how you want to do it. I find it easy just to add the basemap and then lower it so it is just above the ground, it flickers a bit but I can live with that. I then just build on it as I can roughly see the lay of the land and the rough contours from the pictures.

Aside from that I run in Windowed mode so I can quickly switch between GE and TRS to check the finer details.

Nathan
 
@ jalandis01

Hi again Jim.

The basemaps can stay put if you want. Just lower them out of sight below ground level so they don’t show in Driver, and raise them again when you want to continue in Surveyor.

When you create uneven terrain the basemaps will automatically raise or lower depending where on the baseboard you are changing terrain levels. Any adjoining basemaps will then usually need raising or lowering to re-adjust their heights to match. You can adjust the heights of any of them independently at any time

There's no need for tracing. Just lay your track/roads where they show on your map, or aerial photo, on the basemap. You can also use the basemaps as targets to place your trees, buildings and textures.

I find getting the compass view directly perpendicular over the area being worked on gives the best accuracy as it avoids parallax errors. With hilly terrain, the basemap, which is a flat plane, can never be directly in contact with every ground level part of the baseboard. If you place a road or rail track over hills and valleys whilst viewing at an angle, they can be way out of line. The vertical viewpoint is particularly necessary when working in wireframe mode where there are fewer visual references.

I also lay invisible track over map contours, then use the height and smooth spline tools to get the land up to the levels shown on the map.


@ Napalm

You can avoid the flickering by going into wireframe mode. When you’re in that mode, try the Alt W toggle to get the more detailed grid segmented view. It’s often clearer to work with.

Cheers
Casper
:)
 
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Or you can just get TranzDem and whip out accurate maps rather quickly...

Geodetic Datum = WGS84
UTMZone = 12S

UTM Southwest Corner Easting = 346640
UTM Southwest Corner Northing = 3682080

UTM Northeast Corner Easting = 440240
UTM Northeast Corner Northing = 3733200

Extension East-West = 93.600 km
Extension North-South = 51.120 km

Trainz World Origin = N 33° 30.182' W 112° 08.601'

Baseboard UTM Grid Offset: x = 0 m, y = 0 m

# Trainz Baseboards East-West = 130
# Trainz Baseboards North-South = 71
# Trainz Baseboards total = 9230
# actually created Trainz Baseboards after filtering = 2437
# hereof in 5 m grid = 2437

Actual Elevation Range Minimum = 251 m
Actual Elevation Range Maximum = 519 m

2437 baseboards generated in about an 3 hours TOTAL, that was finding the DEM, and vector route, downloading the raster maps then getting 2400 ft google earth snapshots to use as UTM tiles along the route and exporting it all to trainz.

Now all I have to do is tweak the tracks and start adding signals and scenery.

TranzDem is the best way I have found to make accurate real life routes...
 
I'll take a look at TrainzDem in the near future. I see also where there are a couple of forum posts on how to use it and it looks pretty good.

Mezzoprezzo - I've got to ask this, if only so I don't have to wish I had later. The download you told me about only has 9 boards. What if I want to add boards and keep those original 9. How would I do it? Copying a directory and renaming it would make sense, but I wouldn't want to screw up my Content Manager. It would seem that if I did just that, then I'd have to kill off my Assets.x file and let CMP rebuild its self in order for it to recognize the new KUID's

Which then brings me around to the KUID thing, and I don't need a long explanation - I'll get to it in the order of learning. But in the process I don't want to randomly number the directories and mess up anything that would either hose my install, or screw up the system. If the answer is 'you can't', then I'll live with it. No worries.

@Kamran - Google Maps is a good thing to use when you want to see things in perspective or get directions from point A to point B.

I've used Google Earth before, but not to the extent that Napalm suggests. It has a lot of features you can use on your PC/laptop and save them. Google Earth is a downloadable application, where as Google Maps is the Internet for the most part. Both of them are fairly easy to use.

Here is a link to tutorials for Google Earth and Google Maps -
http://earth.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=176576
 
jalandis01 said:
~snip~
Mezzoprezzo - I've got to ask this, if only so I don't have to wish I had later. The download you told me about only has 9 boards. What if I want to add boards and keep those original 9. How would I do it? Copying a directory and renaming it would make sense, but I wouldn't want to screw up my Content Manager. It would seem that if I did just that, then I'd have to kill off my Assets.x file and let CMP rebuild its self in order for it to recognize the new KUID's
~snip~
Click to expand...

You can create more basemaps by cloning the asset as many times as you want. I’ve not done this because I’ve never used more than 4 at a time (so far!). It’s probably best to eventually delete them from your creations in Surveyor anyway, partly to reduce the number of memory consuming assets placed on the baseboard, and also to remove the temptation of constant refining the end result – ending with a never ending work in progress!

Someone else will have to advise on the cloning process. I've never done it.

With regard to DEM programs, I think it’s a good idea to do it the hard way to start with. It’s all part of the learning process. I found laying contours helped with a better understanding of paper maps and how the various function in Surveyor work. Once, learned, however, it is nice to find new tools to make the process easier and quicker.

I had a brief attempt at getting my terrain formed automatically. I cannot remember how I did it (I don’t think it was TransDem), but I created a route in Surveyor called “Google disp map” where I somehow copied a part of the Mediterranean coastline to a 750m square, and ended up with a very “spiky” looking result. It didn’t look at all like the land I was trying to create. Maybe the source map data wasn't up to it. Anyway, at that point I gave up and went back to my current method.

Sorry if I’m partly hijacking Jim’s thread here , but what I’m looking for is a way of having the terrain created without having to make too much manual adjustment. The invisible track contour method which I currently use has the track laid over contours spaced at 25ft intervals “basemapped” from a 1:25000 paper map. When the track Smooth Spline Height tool is used I get a terraced effect which has to be hand corrected. I tried using a temporary network of additional invisible tracks to link the originals for a gentler slope between contours, which improve things a bit. However, I still have to get rid of a few of the remaining peaks and depressions manually, by gently raising or lowering each of the offending grid intersections. Great fun at first ... then mind numbingly boring, (and alarmingly soothing:eek: ). A bit like popping bubble wrap!

I guess the source data is the key to a good result. If the use of TransDem really does help to avoid a lot of final “finishing”, and someone can guide me to a good source for Italian and/or UK mapping, I’d love to give it another try.

Cheers
Casper
 
mezzoprezzo said:
I guess the source data is the key to a good result. If the use of TransDem really does help to avoid a lot of final “finishing”, and someone can guide me to a good source for Italian and/or UK mapping, I’d love to give it another try.
Click to expand...

Casper has hit the nail on the head here with regards to using TransDem for European and UK routes, there isn't a great deal of high quality Dems available for the area. Although someone might prove me wrong as I havn't looked recently but when I did last look there was not.

I prefer to do it the way I mentioned and I also only use about 4 basemaps and then just change the texture map.

Nathan
 
G'day Mezzoprezzo,

As disseminated in numerous places two years ago, perhaps, by TransDEM creator Dr. Roland Ziegler, 1 arcsec (30 meter - 25 actually) resolution DEMs are now available for the entire Globe, for free, from the Japanese server of ASTER GDEM, from this link...

http://www.gdem.aster.ersdac.or.jp/index.jsp

...although you do have to register, which is free and you may find an occasional glitch or two that might need correcting. These DEMs are three times more accurate than the usual 3 arcsec (90 meter) SRTM DEMs to which we are accustomed. Of course, this increase in accuracy comes at a price; the download files off the site are considerably larger and the completed routes exported into Trainz are correspondingly bigger...

...I wouldn't say I'd "swear by them" but they have proved useful here and there...

Jerker {:)}
 
Good afternoon everyone.

Firstly, apologies for asking more questions in Jim’s thread. Hopefully it’s on topic, relevant and helpful.

Thanks Nathan and Jerker, for the additional

Here’s part of one of my hills. The invisible track contours, together with the Smooth Spline tool, have helped shape the hillside - leaving the inevitable terracing. Where the 25ft interval height contours are close together I have to chose the best option when smoothing, because they will inevitably reshape the higher and/or lower contours on the hill. Some trial and error is needed, and just one tap on the mouse LMB is advised because additional taps just makes it worse by widening the terrace.

I’ve done some hand finishing in the area above the compass from the hilltop to where you can see the bottom flyout. The "unfinished" Smooth Spline terraces can be seen either side of that area.

It’s probably too much to expect to get a perfectly finished result from DEM software. However, could I expect to get as good a result, or better, with TransDem utilising the Japanese data, than the unfinished terracing results shown in this shot?

Cheers
Casper

contours.jpg

Imageshack
 
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